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3 year old hurdlers

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  • #16208
    Avatar photonighthorse
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    I’ve noticed quite a few hurdle races this summer for 3-year-olds. I am almost sure that horses never used to be sent over jumps til they were at least 4, preferably 5, or am I wrong?

    Surely it cannot be good for them at that age? They are still babies really.

    #317333
    apracing
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    Brown Jack won his hurdle debut as a 3-y-old at Bournemouth in September 1927. He went on to run ten times that NH season, ending up with a win in the Champion Hurdle as a 4-y-old.

    Switched to the flat, in a long career, he won the Ascot Stakes, the Chester, Doncaster and Goodwood Cups, the Ebor and six consecutive runnings of the Queen Alexandra Stakes at Royal Ascot, the last as a 1-y-old in 1934.

    So it’s not a new thing (except that there was no NH racing in June and July then), and it didn’t seem to do him any harm.

    In fact, even further back, prior to WW1, Cheltenham used to have a 4-y-old only steeplechase as part of the March meeting we now call the Festival. It was no small event either – I have a 1913 form book that shows the National Hunt Juvenile Chase was the most valuable race of the two day meeting.

    AP

    #317334
    Prufrock
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    • Total Posts 2081

    There have been 3-y-o hurdles for as long as I can remember.

    SYBILLIN won one on August 4th of his 3-y-o year in 1989 and landed the big juvenile hurdle at Aintree the following April before racing on until he was 11.

    Jeremy Grayson will be along shortly to tell you of countless other examples like this.

    #317335
    Avatar photoRoddy Owen
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    • Total Posts 441

    What about France,Juvenile hurdles are the norm.

    #317344
    Avatar photograysonscolumn
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    Jeremy Grayson will be along shortly to tell you of countless other examples like this.

    Will he? (((starts to panic))) 8)

    All I will say at this juncture, Nighthorse, is that whilst juvenile hurdles have been part of the fixture list for as long as anyone may care to remember, the date of the first one in the season has crept steadily forward in recent years. The first one this season took place at Hexham on Derby Day, if memory serves.

    I’ve no objection whatsoever to that in essence, though I do question to what extent all participants in races that early in the summer have undergone adequate schooling.

    You have to go as much off trainer reputation in such instances as anything else – a summer juvenile hurdler running for David Pipe, Evan Williams or even Jeff Pearce may at least give some impression of knowing what a hurdle looks like and how to get to the other side of it, whereas one for the likes of Alan Berry frequently does not.

    gc

    Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.

    #317347
    apracing
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    • Total Posts 4009

    GC,

    I’ll get you off the hook with the all time clincher – a horse that ran over hurdles as a 3-y-old and clearly didn’t let it hamper his future career.

    Red Rum.

    No further debate needed.

    AP

    #317350
    Avatar photograysonscolumn
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    LOL, thanks AP!

    More recently, of course, starting one’s juvenile hurdle career as early as June 8th didn’t do Barizan a lot of harm come the business end of the season, did it…

    gc

    Jeremy Grayson. Son of immigrant. Adoptive father of two. Metadata librarian. Freelance point-to-point / horse racing writer, analyst and commentator wonk. Loves music, buses, cats, the BBC Micro, ale. Advocate of CBT, PACE and therapeutic parenting. Aspergers.

    #317352
    Irish Stamp
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    • Total Posts 3176

    What about France,Juvenile hurdles are the norm.

    Spot on Roddy – the first 3yo hurdle that I know of in France is at Auteuil in March, there’s a good program of listed and conditions hurdles at Auteuil, Enghien and provincial courses such as Dieppe and Chateaubriant which lead up to the Grade 1 Prix Cambaceres (won in 2008 by Long Run) at the International Jumps Weekend in November.

    The Triumph Hurdle is now a 4yo Hurdle also rather than a 4yo Novices Hurdle.

    #317386
    Avatar photobefair
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    Al Eile started very early in summer as a 3 yr old hurdler

    #317433
    Avatar photoMiss Woodford
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    The best American chaser of the 1920s, Jolly Roger raced four times over the big fences in his 3yo season, winning two, including the Elkridge Steeplechase. He went on to a very successful career, winning 18 of 49 starts, and was inducted into the Hall of Fame in 1965. Other champions who jumped at 3 include Benguala, Soothsayer, and Warm Spell (1991 champion 3yo hurdler and 1994 Eclipse Champion Steeplechaser).

    #317436
    Grey Desire
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    • Total Posts 1938

    The standard of juvenile hurdles this summer has been shocking,most of the horses have jumped as if the first hurdle on their debut was the first they’d seen in their lives.

    Although it won’t happen I’m not sure we should be running juvenile hurdles until the season proper gets underway.

    #317438
    detroit orchid
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    • Total Posts 64

    i remember backing katchit in a 3yr old hurdle at market rasen in either august or september, he bolted up

    the rest is history as they say

    and muggins here didn’t back him in the triumph or the champion the following year :lol:

    #317530
    sloopjohnb
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    • Total Posts 4

    It,s difficult to analyse the form of 3 year old hurdlers.The main reason is that you cannot quantify the physical improvement in most 3 year olds,who are still far off maturity….John

    #317534
    Avatar photoSeven Towers
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    I would echo the concerns voiced by others that some of the horses run in the races behave as though they’ve seen a hurdle before.
    If the trainer can’t be bothered to school the horse how well have they assessed the horses physical ability to cope with the extra attrition of jumping obstacles and running over a minimum trip of 2 miles.
    Some horses cope with this as have been cited on this thread, but for every Red Rum and Al Eile how many moderate horses have had their careers curtailed through injury after having been run over obstacles at too young an age as a last resort having proven no good on the level?

    #317601
    Adrian
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    • Total Posts 1041

    Further to Irish Stamp’s reply I think the first 3yo hurdle of the year in France was the Prix Carcaradec over 3400 metres at Mont-de-Marsan on 7th March. The first 3yo hurdle in Paris was the Prix d’Essai des Poulains over 3100 metres at Enghien on 9th March.

    Amazingly on 29th July, at Clairefontaine, they ran the Prix de la Garenne over 3700 metres. It was a steeplechase for 3yos !

    #338841
    carvillshill
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    • Total Posts 2778

    There was some excellent veterinary work done a few years ago which seemed to suggest that the reality of this is counterintuitive- that is, the earlier horses are put into training the more likely they are to stay sound. Makes perfect sense to me- the sooner you begin training young tendons, ligaments and bones the sturdier and more resistent to damage they become. The recent success of French bred horses in National Hunt racing surely proves the point. the age of the old-style Irish 5yo "store" horse may be over.

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