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If he goes to Newmarket, he’ll be the ideal pacemaker for Churchill……
Blackbeard to conquer the World
Still no idea who to back for the 2000 guineas. Have a small e/w on Rivet but really have questions if he likes the course. Churchill is way too short? Who are the leading contenders? Any tips……
Well, here’s a turn up for the books! Aidan happy with how Caravaggio worked at Naas the other day, and he goes straight to the Guineas at either Newmarket or Deauville.
Hmm… hard to say if this is reason to be worried or confident about Caravaggio’s progress, but I’d probably lean towards the former. Maybe Steve is right to draw the AFB comparison, as there was similar talk about him being a monster and one of their fastest ever. I definitely couldn’t be having a bet on him if he does show up at Newmarket.
What did you’s make of Dream Castle’s win earlier? Too early to get excited, after just a maiden win, but he really did have a touch of Frankel about him. I’ll have a bit of the 33’s on offer.
Meanwhile Churchill’s form is franked yet again. He really should be odds on and probably will go off that way.
You can’t ask for much more than that on debut even if he was 4/7.
He’ll come on loads as well considering he was head strong in the opening part of the race. The Guineas would come too soon in my opinion against more experienced and better rated animals but good luck and one for the notebook for sure.Blackbeard to conquer the World
Yes he’ll certainly need to settle better if he’s to run well in a Guineas, unless he really is his father’s son !
Maybe Steve is right to draw the AFB comparison, as there was similar talk about him being a monster and one of their fastest ever. I definitely couldn’t be having a bet on him if he does show up at Newmarket.
[/quote]Another monster this year
http://www.goracing.ie/News/?news=P-5e5b2cf9-1c57-4f1a-b3ba-aef1fe5a521e
Some firms go way too short Dream Castle at 20/1 for the Guineas.
I mentioned the horse as one to look out for on 12th June last year over on the Frankel Rule The World thread. At that time he held an entry in the Phoenix Stakes in Ireland, so obviously he was well regarded.
In a normal Guineas year I wouldn’t entertain anything winning a maiden at this time of the year, but outside of Churchill there is a lot of dross in the Guineas market this season.
You would tend to think some of the unraced ones from last year will come to the fore this season as the more established names plateau or drop away.
The Guineas just comes too early though and it is asking an awful lot to go from maiden to Group 1 in just four weeks.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
From what the jockey said afterwards, it is temperament issues that have delayed his debut, so even more unlikely to rush him I would think.
Looking through the top of the market I can’t see anything that would worry Churchill unless they improve enormously. War Decree would maybe be of interest if he’s trained on, but that’s a big if and it’s also not certain he’d be sent to Newmarket anyway.
I think I’m going to go to Newmarket for the first time for this meet so I’m a bit disappointed with the current Guineas picture. I’m hoping something really puts in a big performance in the Craven to shake things up a bit.
War Decree was given a very light 2yo campaign as that is perhaps the key to the War Fronts at 3yo+. He needs good ground, so he’s unlikely to go to France. I can see them firing three shots at the 2000 Guineas, they’ve been changing their modus operandi over the past 12 months, running their top horses against each other. There’s a big upside to any of the three stallions, Galileo, War Front and Scat Daddy, siring the winner of the 2000 Guineas. They can all go their different ways afterwards.
Yes he’ll certainly need to settle better if he’s to run well in a Guineas, unless he really is his father’s son !
I didn’t think he was bad at all regarding settling. He was a little bit keen and wandered slightly but I was never concerned that he was going along out of control and he settled fine enough in behind. I would have been far more concerned had he wanted to get to the front.
John Gosden’s Seven Heavens was certainly an awful lot worse a couple of times last year.
They would need to get a trial into Dream Castle for him to have a chance in the Guineas. The Greenham would be the one to go for but it’s tight and he would need to show big improvement twice in four weeks to be competitive.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Yes he wasn’t terribly keen, but still keener than you would like for a maiden winner going into the Guineas, assuming he does, especially with a very strong finisher like Churchill in the race.
You are probably right about the Guineas coming too soon, added to the fact Godolphin looks to have a respectable team assembled for the race. However you feel we might have seen the best of these horses, with very few unexposed. Dream Castle could be anything, and having missed out on a 2yo season, I hope they take the risk.
It’s a shame we won’t see Carravaggio over 7 in Dundalk. It would have been quite informative, regardless of the opposition.
Looking through the top of the market I can’t see anything that would worry Churchill unless they improve enormously. War Decree would maybe be of interest if he’s trained on, but that’s a big if and it’s also not certain he’d be sent to Newmarket anyway.
I think I’m going to go to Newmarket for the first time for this meet so I’m a bit disappointed with the current Guineas picture. I’m hoping something really puts in a big performance in the Craven to shake things up a bit.
I somehow doubt the plan was to put War Decree away for the winter after the Vintage Stakes. You would think the plan was one more race at least. I am not keen on Classic contenders who don’t race beyond July in their 2yo season. To me it sends the signal that something hasn’t gone to plan.
In Highland Reel’s year, he somewhat surprisingly dropped back to 7F from the mile of his maiden win, to also take in the Vintage Stakes at Goodwood. Something seemed to go amiss with him after that and we did not see him again until the French 2000 Guineas, where he was hot favourite but only sixth. I just wonder if something similar occurred with War Decree this time?
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Aidan said immediately after the race, that’s it for him for this year, we’ll train him for something like the French Guineas next year. I thought that was a bit strange because War Fronts generally need good ground and he’s not guaranteed that in France, but maybe they thought they had Newmarket covered with Churchill and Caravaggio.
But Orderofthegarter has now laid down a marker for the French Guineas, and Cliffs of Moher is also entered, and both are proven on soft ground, though they don’t need it.Yes he wasn’t terribly keen, but still keener than you would like for a maiden winner going into the Guineas, assuming he does, especially with a very strong finisher like Churchill in the race.
You are probably right about the Guineas coming too soon, added to the fact Godolphin looks to have a respectable team assembled for the race. However you feel we might have seen the best of these horses, with very few unexposed. Dream Castle could be anything, and having missed out on a 2yo season, I hope they take the risk.
It’s a shame we won’t see Carravaggio over 7 in Dundalk. It would have been quite informative, regardless of the opposition.
I’d love to see Dream Castle in the Craven or Greenham. That would mean 18 or 20 days between his debut and the trial and then either 16 or 14 days to the Classic. It’s doable from a realistic spacing point of view.
Oisin Murphy said he felt the colt would not be out of place in a Classic.
To my eyes it looked like Dream Castle will get a mile. This would be more likely still if he settles from the start but at no stage yesterday did it look like the early keenness had taken a toll at the finish. I actually felt the colt was just hitting top gear once the race was already secured.
The Racing Post awarded Dream Castle a rating of 89 and a Topspeed figure of 71, both decent figures for a debut.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Aidan said immediately after the race, that’s it for him for this year, we’ll train him for something like the French Guineas next year. I thought that was a bit strange because War Fronts generally need good ground and he’s not guaranteed that in France, but maybe they thought they had Newmarket covered with Churchill and Caravaggio.
But Orderofthegarter has now laid down a marker for the French Guineas, and Cliffs of Moher is also entered, and both are proven on soft ground, though they don’t need it.That was not what I heard after the race.
On the website Horse Racing 247, the article published on 27th July (The day after the Vintage Stakes) had the following segment regarding War Decree going forward:-
Where next?
On future targets Kevin Buckley, representing owners Coolmore, nominated the “Champagne Stakes or the National Stakes” as options for War Decree, and added: “given his pedigree, [a trip to the USA] is certainly a possibility.”That sounds very like they were planning at least one, and possibly two more runs. The other explanation would be that Kevin Buckley and Aidan O’Brien do not know what the other is thinking from one day to the next. Not great that they wouldn’t be on the same page.
The link to the webpage detailing Buckley’s statement is here:-
https://www.horseracing247.net/goodwood-war-decree-powers-home-in-vintage-stakes/
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
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