February 22, 2007 at 12:35 #896davidjohnsonMember
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Since when has it been permitted for horses to be given a handicap mark based on it’s pedigree and connections? The BHB assessor has given this horse, a facile winner of it’s only start a rating of 85. This in in spite of him having just 2 1/2 lengths to spare over Oasis Sun (rated 49) 3 1/2 over Simpsons Ross (59) and 4 1/4 over Pantomine Prince (42).
Perhaps Stoute would have been better running him over an inadequate trip 3 times rather than showing his hand first time up, or can we look forward to this new approach of pedigree/connections handicapping being applied to Prescott so we are spared pattern-bred inmates rattling up sequences off marks in the 50’s.February 22, 2007 at 13:30 #39664yeatsParticipant
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What price will it be though if it runs in a handicap? A pretty short one I bet unless it’s a big field. I think you underestimate how shrewd the handicappers are, he didn’t have to give it a mark and if they’re not happy with the mark they can run it in a conditions race.February 22, 2007 at 13:32 #39665FlatSeasonLoverMember
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I can see DJ point that it encourages trainers to mask a horses ability though.February 22, 2007 at 20:09 #39667roryParticipant
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The handicapper would look a right tit if he gave him a mark of 53, wouldn’t he? :biggrin:February 22, 2007 at 22:57 #39669Irish StampMember
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The conversation’s go something like this.
Handicapper: will you let me know when he’ll win?<br>Sir Mark: Yes<br>Handicapper: 53 it is then
<br>Handicapper: will you let us know when he’ll win?<br>Sir Michael: No<br>Handicapper: have 83February 22, 2007 at 23:28 #39671SmithyMember
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I would speculate that Zam Zammah was value for slightly further than the winning margin on that occasion……
Whether he was 30lb better than that though………..February 23, 2007 at 00:04 #39672AlderbrookMember
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The art of handicapping eh?February 25, 2007 at 18:00 #39676LingfieldMember
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It’s declared in the 4 o’clock at Lingfield AW on Tuesday- a 1 mile ,4 year old and upwards H’cap.<br>Gets weight off the top one Capable Guest and is predicted to be odds on.February 27, 2007 at 11:02 #39677davidjohnsonMember
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I’ve had to lay this beast with no form at under 2/1. Might well win but looks awfully short.February 27, 2007 at 15:23 #39681AnonymousInactive
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Quote: from Hugh Taylor on 11:08 am on Feb. 27, 2007[br]If we had more winners-of-one type races, the handicapper wouldn’t need to be put in this predicament. All too often winning first time out is detrimental to a horse’s long-term career prospects unless the horse has the ability and maturity to progress to Listed level right away.
One would expect M Stoute to know the time of day in this respect, and with this horse?<br>DJ, you have been warned.;)February 27, 2007 at 18:20 #39683sporting samParticipant
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I watched this race today and pre race the commentator remarked that times at Lingfield had been very fast today possibly "due to the amount of rain". Capable Guest and Zam Zammah were short enough not at any price I could get involved in.<br>The racing post assessment was fair to Derek Shaw`s horse and Gallantry was being backed so I jumped on too and was delighted to see Mr Spenser holding his horse up at the back before leaving it too late to make his challenge. <br>Its clear the handicapper has done the right thing and Zam Zammah looks destined for much better things.February 28, 2007 at 08:09 #39684alan1Member
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Funny you should mention this horse. A couple of months back I applied for the vacant Handicappers job. I was fortunate to get an interview, and part of the interview process was that they showed you a race and was asked to handicap it. The race I was shown was Zam Zammahs first race which you mention.
However the interesting part is what the guy who was interviewing me (who is one of the hcapers) said. He said to totally ignore the winner in any assessment I do as he could be anything, and that they had the power to defer giving a horse a hcap rating in exceptional circumstances when they feel that they didn’t have enough info, until it got entered into a hcap. And his opinion was that this horse would never run in a hcap, as he felt it was potentiallytop class.
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