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The Johnson govt bears a significant responsibility for the terrible death toll, over 30,000 of us so far, a number so high it becomes a statistic and loses its emotional impact. Despite the example of what was happening in Italy, and whether due to incompetence or ideology or both, they decided to ‘take it on the chin,’ not impose an early lockdown and abandon any attempt at contact tracing. The lack of PPE for health and care workers and the spin about ‘100k tests by May 1st’ was more evidence of incompetence.
I accept that different countries have different methods of collecting data, so comparisons are difficult, but these graphs are informative.Sorry chestnut only just seen your query about Newmarket and it’s Heath which is quite correct it does have a very old one but believe it is Warren Hill and Long Hill that forms the main part of old Newmarket Heath where racing used to take place but is now used for training and gallops.
This area is across town from the 2 racecourses the July Course bounded by the National Stud and private estates and stud farms and The Rowley Mile which is also well enclosed from the public view.
Things turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out...If the government had prepared for a pandemic then it would probably not have been one like this.
Preparing for something which has never happened before is impossible. ie Had they prepared for a pandemic very different then things might have been even worseWhat does “not have been like this” or “never happened before” mean? A pandemic is a pandemic and they follow a more or less similar growth-and-decline gaussian distribution curve, whatever the nature of the pathogen. What is unknown is how long this virus will continue to be infectious and how lethal it will remain i.e how flat and broad the curve will be
At present it has surpassed the seasonal flu outbreak of 1989-90 which caused excess deaths of 26,000 in the UK; on a par with the Asian Flu pandemic of 1957-58 with 33,000 excess; and someway behind the Hong Kong Flu of 1968-69 with 80,000 excess. The latter two pandemics led to 1-4 million deaths worldwide
Measures to mitigate these outbreaks were largely non-existant (for which the MacMillan government of 1957 got a bollocking) and as I personally remember the 1968 outbreak, I can confirm life continued as normal, even had to keep going to school
Which suggests
a) that the severe restrictions now in place are a gross over-reaction to ‘just another pandemic’
b) it would have been much worse had they not been introduced
c) this is the beginning of the end
d) this is just the end of the beginningYour choice and your guess will be as good/bad as mine or anyone’s
We elect governments to lead us and make decisions on our behalf and in our best interests. They are the ones with access to all of the resources they need to come up with the right decisions. To criticise the man in the street for behaving within the guidelines in place at the time is ridiculous. The simple fact is that the government has failed badly. The problem of course is that have is that they suddenly have a real crisis on their hands with tangible effects like mass deaths that can’t be explained away by bluster and waffle but that’s all they know how to do. Sadly for them that only works on manufactured crises.
Quite how anybody thinks they’ve handled this well is beyond me. I’d love to know how bad it would have to be before some people started criticising them. If I may indulge in a bit of whataboutery, one wonders if we’d see the same reactions from the same people if we had a different party in power.
Yes, the virus is an unpredictable beast but many other countries have done a hell of a lot better at handling it that we have, including places far more densely populated than we are.
I am a lefty snowflake though so I guess my opinion doesn’t count
To answer your question with questions, Drone:
“Not have been like this” and “never happened before” mean:Have any of the serious pandemics you mention had so many infectious people who’ve shown no or so few symptoms as this one?
Have any of the serious pandemics you mention had symptoms varying so differently from person to person?
Has any of the serious pandemics you mention been around when it’s been (before “Lockdown”) so easy for people to move around from place to place – within countries as well as from country to country?
Has any of the serious pandemics you mention been around with as many people living so close together – average population per square mile is much greater nowadays? I realise that in times gone by in any one city a pandemic may have swept through poorer districts even faster – with people living close together. But cities were themselves separated more by open countryside (fewer people)…
Has any of the serious pandemics you mention been around when so many people have been suseptible to them? ie We have an aging population and many of them – and wider population (including myself) have poor immune systems – are kept alive by miraculous medicines… until this pandemic hits.
Yes, lessons can be learnt from previous pandemics, but I’d suggest we do have some unique circumstances with this one.
Value Is Everything- Total Posts 2553
Better than a mug of cocoa.
Night
A semi-skimmed argument is hopefully what I have presented thus far. If you are considering the merits or otherwise of appropriate action, or correct preparation, or following the correct science, in the case of a pandemic, politics has absolutely nothing to do with it. If any government, of whatever political persuasion, had a approached this global catastrophe in the same way this government has, I would be equally as scathing.
Be….fair,
Not only do countries have different methods of collecting data, they also have different sizes of population and – probably just as importantly with this virus – different population densities. Do the figures you link to account for this? Population and densities are after all the reason why big cities of the World are all suffering badly from this pandemic – so the same must be true to a certain extent with countries too.According to Wikipedia population figures:
England 55’619,400 population, 424 people per square kilometre.
Germany 82’887,000 population but just 232 per square kilometre.
Italy 60’404,355 and only 200 per sq km.
France 65’167,000 with much less density of 118
Spain 46’659,302 and yet not many at all per sq km 92.Of course we are not doing as well as Germany with this pandemic, but once population and population density are taken in to account I don’t think England is – at the moment – doing too badly compared to the other major European countries of Italy, France and Spain.
Value Is EverythingThey seemed to have handled it very well in the country of origin, Ginger. Where they tested a wider range of their population and lockdown was tougher. Yet when a natural disaster happens it affects more than any other countries in the world, so per square kilometres the must be more population than anywhere else.
The best things in life are free.
But you can give them to the birds and bees.So we have a date of 1st June if all goes to plan and there isn’t a second wind of this virus. BHA say they will be ready to resume on this date. Which probably means Guineas weekend at the end of June (could these be run on the same day?) and Derby/Oaks weekend possibly end of July. Will they try to fit Royal Ascot in between, say mid July, although this may discount some of the best 3 year olds. But we can no hiccups if this is to happen. Group One races such as the Coral Eclipse/King George may have to be scrapped
‘ We are guided mainly by the science ‘, is a throwaway line that could have been pitched at Nuernberg.
Ginge, a beautiful mind, but numbers will only ever tell half of the story. May I cordially recommend a cold watergate shower and a reality bar of soap. This has been the biggest cover up since Nixon started replaying poker and the Hitler diaries were covered in the broad sheets. The wide scale neglect and slaughter of innocent lambs, that has happened in the whole of Europe in care homes is totally indefensible
As for the racing and its deficiency on home turf I must say from a purely selfish angle I have seen the foreign markets growing and never in a million years would I have entertained adding harness racing to my itinerary – but it has proved an out and out joy.
flatcapgamble…Nixon funded the commencement of his political career from his poker winnings.
“So we have a date of 1st June if all goes to plan and there isn’t a second wind of this virus.”
No chance of a second wave not happening. You already had thousands of idiots out and about before Bozo’s “speech” on Sunday evening; there are going to be millions of them now. The second wave will be here by the end of this month.
Hello,
Seeking the Forum’s opinion….
I visit Unison Day at Donny every summer. This year it is scheduled for 01 August.
What chance do you think that the meeting will go ahead as planned? if so, do you think crowds will be admitted??regards,
doyley
No chance of a second wave not happening. You already had thousands of idiots out and about before Bozo’s “speech” on Sunday evening
How do you mean? What is the problem with being able to drive up to the Lake District or down to Cornwall but not go around the corner to visit your mum
What chance do you think that the meeting will go ahead as planned? Meeting may go ahead but not as originally planned.
if so, do you think crowds will be admitted?? Sod all chance
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