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Wasn’t Black Jack Ketchum, the same one that ducked Denman at Cheltenam, "the best i’ve (McCoy) ever sat on".
Didn’t Walsh get on the wrong one in this years Gold Cup?All jockeys are playing the game – good rides pay good money.
I prefer Grasshoppers ‘analytical’ approach to your ‘trust the jockeys word’ approach.
Cheers Bos’ very atmospheric and conveys a winter afternoon’s sport very well …Sandown is easily the most cosy and customer friendly Grade 1 track
A few photos before the big race on Saturday.
TWIST MAGIC PRE-PARADE
http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii11 … agic-1.jpgTIDAL BAY IN BOX W/ MASTER MINDED & TAKEROC WALKING PAST
http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii11 … parade.jpgMASTER MINDED PARADE RING W/ FIEPES SHUFFLE
http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii11 … minded.jpgTIDAL BAY PARADE RING W/ TAKEROC
http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii11 … dalbay.jpgNice photos – much better than mine actually! Got to say I was standing only a few feet away from you in the parade ring!! Pretty sure you’d have seen us – we were the ones being rather noisy!!
Darren – AngloGerman
________________________________________‘The Hungarian’s going hell for leather’ – Jim McGrath
Does everyone on here really feel that VPU wasnt a very very good 2mile chaser at the festival? the horse has bin outstanding every festival it has run in evry1 to beating monets garden and foreman in the arkle by 2 lengths to beating dempsey in the champion chase.Last year i did a 10£ antepost patent katchit ch our vic ryanair and vpu cc and thought vpu was the safest.Surely this master minded is a machine i believe that vpu is still the best 2 mile chaser at cheltenham come fetival time bar master minded?.In the great days wen azy took on mf and wc i was always a massive azy fan and moscow did prove himself to me the more he raced 3 gr8 2mile chasers but i just think this mm is a very very special horse indeed what a race if you could see them 4 racing
i just believe vpu dosent get the credit he deserves roll on the festival when the class act will prove himself once again in the ryanir which i believe is the perfect trip for vpu and imo is the ryanir winner at the festivasl hes 1 off my fav horses for chelt and will always produce and try 100%thats why i love the horse to bits- Total Posts 17716
You do have a full stop on your keyboard, don’t you chelt king – I read your last post out loud and almost suffocated
Voy Por Ustedes clearly isn’t up to the standard of the likes of Azertyuiop and Well Chief, and so defeating him isn’t necessarily any pre-cursor to two-mile greatness, but Master Minded absolutely demolished him in the Champion Chase and couldn’t have been far off his RPR of 187.
Perhaps the King horse has been over-rated, but on his performances at Aintree, and behind Knowhere more recently, I’m not so sure. Even his Tingle Creek defeat to Twist Magic showed that a rating in the high 160s isn’t too unbelievable (Hoo La Baloo makes the form slightly questionable as regard deciding who to rate the race around, but Monet’s Garden went into the race having just beaten Kauto Star).
Only time will tell, but I get the feeling that no performance will ever be good enough for people to believe that Master Minded is better than, or even the equal of, Moscow Flyer. Here’s hoping for the emergence of another two-mile star to offer just a little insight.
Well done Grasshopper, Clivex et al.
Need to consider whether Tidal Bay could be the horse for the King George now.
Cheers Salselon. Pity you couldnt make it. Paul was there and it was a fanatstic days racing. Jumps at Sandown is something special
Watching the race again, I wonder again whether kempton will now suit TB.
As for Master Minded, he will never be backable again but its hardly controversial to say think we are watching an extraordinarily talented jumper here. Mccoy handled him superbly, completely vindicating the decision and maybe its just me, but i sense he simply knew he had the race completely in the bag a mile out.
Not sure beating Dempsey makes a horse a great 2m chaser or beating Foreman and Monet’s Garden is a great advert either, but you can only beat what’s there and VPU did that for his 2 wins. You had to be impressed by Master Minded though Twist Magic would have been 2nd but for the fall and probably only by 5 or 6 lengths maybe less (admittedly MM wasn’t pressed so may have opened up by more). Using a line through Natal, that really doesn’t amount to the greatest piece of form ever, so its hard to fully evaluate Saturday’s run apart from saying baring accident or something emerging from nowhere MM surely has the Queen Mum at his mercy this year though.
I know beating Dempsey doesn’t make you a good horse. Dempsey was a complete outsider the 3rd River City hasn’t won a race in 4 years……VPU was handed a race on a plate to him Aintree and has done next to nothin in between……even the biggest non staying 2 mile chaser in the country Twist Magic mangaed to make him look ordinary at Sandown which is a fairly stiff track for him.
He is o more than a ice horse who was the best of a really bad bunch for Pete’s sake……….look back at all the 2 mile champion races and name one horse you would back VPU to beat………Moscow Flyer? Barnbrook Again? Dunkirk? Flyingbolt? Badsworth Boy?, Martha Son, Klairon? Davies? damned if I can think of one who wouldn’t have pissed all over him……things a comparitive boat and is absolutely no giude to how good Master Minded is…………..Over 2 miles Master Minded is in the Twighlight Zone for horses where VPU simply does not exist.
Master minded indeed is the best 2mile chaser in training but what does VPU have to do to gain sum respect?.Yes he beat not the best horses wen he won the arkle and qmcc but he won them nevertheless!.People gotta remember if master minded hadnt bin found this fella would now be a dual QMCC chase winner and a Arkle winner to boot!.Lets get real you run takeroc twist magic tidal bay over 2miles march time against VPU they is surly only 1 winner?.But thats not going to happen so we can only wonder all im saying is if the brilliant MM hadnt bin found and VPU won the CC last year by 20 lenghts would he still be getting all the stick or instead a lot off praise?.All i can say is i havent lost faith in this fella 1 bit and he was a high class 2mile chaser around cheltenham at his best and just ran into a young up and coming machine in MM
But i really hope Tidal Bay goes for the Ryanair chase at the festival which race im really looking 4ord to.I beleive that VPU will win this race.You have got the young pretenders in Noland and TB plus last years winner Our vic and the young improving chaser Barbers Shop.I just beleive this race is tailour made for the former CC winner to return to cheltenham come march time and make his oustanding festival form look even better.Imo last years ryanair was a poor race so just think our vic will have a bit more on his plate too sharp for Barbers shop.Noland poor festival form last year and just beleive VPU will prove himself come festival time once again and prove all his doubters wrong!.We shall see only time will tell.
Oh ive done a 20£ ante post patent what do people think all thoughts welcome
1.Champ hurdle Crack Away Jack 7/1
2.Ryanair Chase Voy Por Ustedes 6/1
3.World Hurdle Pettifour 16/1- Total Posts 17716
Well done Grasshopper, Clivex et al.
Need to consider whether Tidal Bay could be the horse for the King George now.
Just my opinion Salse, but I believe he’d be better over 3m than 2.5.
He was being scrubbed along even before the pace picked up on Saturday, and didn’t jump like a horse that would be a whole lot better over only 4f further.
No reason to think he wouldn’t stay the KG trip, imo it would give him the chance to show his true class, and I’d much rather be on him than Kauto Star at a fraction of the price.Howard Johnson said on Ceefax that TB was frightened by Flippers fall at the first but that he was pleased with his running…not sure what to make of that really..he was never going to be seriously hard ridden anyway with the King George so close.
…..he was never going to be seriously hard ridden anyway with the King George so close.
You didn’t see the last two furlongs then, moehat? Tidal Bay was ridden vigorously, and right out to the line, to overcome Takeroc.
Howard Johnson has already hinted that the King George may come too quickly for Tidal Bay anyway, and the suggestion that the jockey didn’t throw everything at the horse at Sandown, is completely erroneous in my opinion. He simply found Master Minded in a different league over the minimum trip.
Howard Johnson said on Ceefax that TB was frightened by Flippers fall at the first but that he was pleased with his running…not sure what to make of that really..he was never going to be seriously hard ridden anyway with the King George so close.
Howard is trying to make Excuses.
If TB was frightened what was MM? He had to jump the fence, then the horse, then the jockey.
VPU could still be said to be the second best 2 mile chaser around (discounting Kauto Star) but he is unlikely to run over 2m at Chelters. The likely second best horse to run in the QM is Twist Magic who I can’t see staying / getting up the hill. Takeroc likewise, or possibly best on flat tracks. Big Zeb, is he alright? Will he come over? Petit Robin might improve to be second best.
Mark
Value Is Everythinginteresting; must say I haven’t watched the replay properly but the jockey said that he ‘didn’t knock him about’ and he only got going towards the end of the race [TB that is]…never know what to make of Mr Johnson!
If he didn’t knock him about there I’d hate to see what he’s like when he is knocking him about.
“If Master Minded wasn’t around we’d be the fastest two miler in the country. We got going when it was over and hopefully we should get in the number one spot next time.”
DENIS O’ REGAN 09/12/08“He has run a good race, he has shown his battling qualities and we are over the moon with him. He stayed on well at the end and Denis didn’t punish him for second.
“I wouldn’t think we would take on the winner again, we will keep well clear of him unless he has got some more lead under the saddle – about 20 stone of it!”
HOWARD JOHNSON 06/12/08The latter comment is hardly Howard Johnson making excuses.
Tidal Bay has an exaggerated head carriage and always gives the impression he’s doing more than he actually is.
If you look back at the race, Tidal Bay was in fourth position shortly after coming round the Pond Fence and half a length down at the final fence. Denis gave him one crack of the whip, he quickly went past Takeroc and was increasing his advantage at the finish.
Tidal Bay wouldn’t have got closer to Master Minded, who wasn’t exactly hard pressed, but he had plenty in reserve had Twist Magic not fallen and an increasing 4L advantage over Takeroc isn’t exactly pulling out all the stops.
His was a classic case of a horse who will be suited by further, as many thought before the race. Looking back at the closing stages, I think Denis called it perfectly – he got going when it was over.
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