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Yes, Miss W, but would he have handled Epsom ?
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
Yes, Miss W, but would he have handled Epsom ?
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
Whatever connections do will be what they believe is best for the horse.
If they decide to run him over 3 miles and he gets beat, providing he isn’t given too hard a time of it then they can switch him back. It didn’t do Cue Card any harm.
On the other hand if they stick to 2 / 2.5 miles then so be it.
Best Mate was shunned by some for never attempting to give lumps of weight away in handicaps, Frankel’s connections were criticised in certain quarters for not running him over 12f in the Arc and are we now to expect that should Sprinter Sacre pull off the remarkable feat of remaining unbeaten throughout his career he’ll be less fondly remembered because he didn’t carry 11st 10 to victory in the Eider ?
What is it with our obsession of pushing a horse to it’s limits ?
I sometimes think some people will never be happy until a horse gets beat.
He’s a champion at his distance and unlike the flat where Frankel had one season to prove himself against the new classic generation, Sprinter Sacre will hopefully have years to take on numerous Arkle winnners and prove himself to be the great we all believe him to be.
Lee
He should run at 3, I’ve said it long before his pedigree holds no fears for a step up in trip. Start him at Haydock, hardly a hard point to start, oh but wait Hendo already has two to run there…
People like being in their comfort zone. It often takes a horse being beat until a trainer declares he needs to go up in trip now. Sprinter Sacre has the ability to beat any at whatever distance.
Wish more trainers would have some cojones like Nigel Twiston-Davies
What is it with our obsession of pushing a horse to it’s limits
Sorry, but isn’t that absolutely, totally, 100% what horse racing (and sport in general) is all about??
Mike
Barry G has posted on twitter that Simonsig and sprinter have worked together but don’t anymore because they both go to hard when together.
But he did also say that Simonsig is the only horse that can get Sprinter off of the bridle!!
Now less of this lets up sprinter in trip. I say get him and Simonsig running against each other in the tingle creek….
Barry G has posted on twitter that Simonsig and sprinter have worked together but don’t anymore because they both go to hard when together.
But he did also say that Simonsig is the only horse that can get Sprinter off of the bridle!!
Now less of this lets up sprinter in trip. I say get him and Simonsig running against each other in the tingle creek….
If Simonsig’s Arkle Chase win is anything to go by, then the evidence would indicate that Nicky’s grey horse would be no match for his Champion chaser.
Gambling Only Pays When You're Winning
What is it with our obsession of pushing a horse to it’s limits
Sorry, but isn’t that absolutely, totally, 100% what horse racing (and sport in general) is all about??
Mike
No Mike, not at all.
Every sporting competitor be it human or equine will have their optimum conditions but that isn’t to say they can’t surpass those on occasions, although at what cost ?
Consider the footballers with socks around their ankles, lying on their backs being treated for cramp at the end of an energy sapping extra time spell.
Does it make for good entertainment ? Yes of course it does but is it good for the players ? Obviously not and surely it can only have an adverse long term effect should it continue to happen.
As I stated at the start of my previous post I’m fairly non fussed either way but what irritates is the number of pundits who feel they know the horse and what is good for it better than connections.
Enjoy him for what he is and if that involves another step up in trip then thats’s fine but if it doesn’t then don’t start criticising the owner/trainer as they can surely not be blamed for ducking challenges to avoid defeat as they have shown no signs of that to date and any reluctance would most likely be in an attempt to keep the horse sound.
FWIW I think he’d win the King George on good ground but would be a very tired horse at the finish.
Lee
Consider the footballers with socks around their ankles, lying on their backs being treated for cramp at the end of an energy sapping extra time spell.
Does it make for good entertainment ? Yes of course it does but is it good for the players ? Obviously not and surely it can only have an adverse long term effect should it continue to happen.
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FWIW I think he’d win the King George on good ground but would be a very tired horse at the finish.
Lee, thank-you for bringing the shocking plight of tired footballers to my attention. If only they received some form of financial recompense for their suffering.
Of course Sprinter Sacre would be tired! He’d be winning the bloody King George – it’s a top-class race!
To be honest, I’m just saying he should be given a spin over 3m first to see if it’s a ‘goer’. Not necessarily the KG first time up. I strongly believe he’ll be tried out at the distance at some point.
Mike
Part of being a ‘genius’
trainer is managing your assets well.Mr H has two Gold Cup winners in his yard and, bar SS, no other realistic Champion Chaser. For all the talk about Simonsig’s potential he has shown nothing like QM winning form so far and I doubt he will ever jump well enough to win a decent running of the QM.
Circumstances will change things – if Bobs Worth and Long Run were, heaven forbid, laid up for a season, Mr Henderson and his jockey might well start to find merit in the stamina aspects of SS’s pedigree. But as things stand, why use three bullets when all that might be needed is one – two at most? Especially when, with the third one, you might end up shooting yourself in the foot.
Part of being a ‘genius’
trainer is managing your assets well.Mr H has two Gold Cup winners in his yard and, bar SS, no other realistic Champion Chaser. For all the talk about Simonsig’s potential he has shown nothing like QM winning form so far and I doubt he will ever jump well enough to win a decent running of the QM.
Circumstances will change things – if Bobs Worth and Long Run were, heaven forbid, laid up for a season, Mr Henderson and his jockey might well start to find merit in the stamina aspects of SS’s pedigree. But as things stand, why use three bullets when all that might be needed is one – two at most? Especially when, with the third one, you might end up shooting yourself in the foot.
And the owners? Do they get a say?
Quite frankly, if I were the Moulds and I wished to run Sprinter Sacre in the Gold Cup (and I’m not suggesting that’s a probability – yet) then that is where he would run. If I was being put off that dream because Mr Henderson has other owners with Gold Cup horses, I would be singularly unimpressed.
Mike
Part of being a ‘genius’
trainer is managing your assets well.Mr H has two Gold Cup winners in his yard and, bar SS, no other realistic Champion Chaser. For all the talk about Simonsig’s potential he has shown nothing like QM winning form so far and I doubt he will ever jump well enough to win a decent running of the QM.
Circumstances will change things – if Bobs Worth and Long Run were, heaven forbid, laid up for a season, Mr Henderson and his jockey might well start to find merit in the stamina aspects of SS’s pedigree. But as things stand, why use three bullets when all that might be needed is one – two at most? Especially when, with the third one, you might end up shooting yourself in the foot.
And the owners? Do they get a say?
Quite frankly, if I were the Moulds and I wished to run Sprinter Sacre in the Gold Cup (and I’m not suggesting that’s a probability – yet) then that is where he would run. If I was being put off that dream because Mr Henderson has other owners with Gold Cup horses, I would be singularly unimpressed.
Mike
And if your respected and highly successful (especially at the festival) trainer said to you "I have no doubt whatsoever that Bobs Worth/Long Run will outstay SS in the King George/Gold Cup", what would you do then?
Nicky Henderson stated Simongsig scoped badly after the Arkle and would most likely have not run had he scoped him before hand. That Arkle run was nothing of what he is capable, that was plain to see, he done his best to lose that Arkle under the weather and still won it! He has tons of ability and the only thing that could give Sprinter Sacre a race as I see it. He will come back some horse next season you will see, don’t always go by the figures…
What will be interesting is to see if they are kept apart and how. Simongsig needs to stay at 2 miles, certainly in the immediate future. I personally think Sprinter Sacre will go on up in trip over next season.
Get him up in trip, ability wins races and he is the most able horse in training, stamina won’t be an issue.
And if your respected and highly successful (especially at the festival) trainer said to you "I have no doubt whatsoever that Bobs Worth/Long Run will outstay SS in the King George/Gold Cup", what would you do then?
Straw man argument. Henderson couldn’t possibly say that prior to SS being even tried out at 3m and that would most likely be in something like the Betfair Chase. If he were to win that, I don’t see how Henderson could then make your fictional remark prior to an attempt at the King George.
So let’s presume it’s now January and SS has two major three mile races under his belt. If as the owner, I was then all for a crack at the Gold Cup and Henderson told me that "Bobs Worth/Long Run will outstay SS" I’d thank him for his advice and point out that they’d have to catch him first!
Honestly, some of the arguments on this thread for opposing an attempt at 3 miles – he’s a 2-miler, he’ll die if he runs at 3m, he might get tired, it might upset other owners – are just some of the most bizarre I’ve ever read.
Of course, he may not stay 3m effectively, in which case all of the above is null and void.
I’m not saying that Sprinter Sacre is a three-mile horse
. But I’m highly surprised that so many seem vehemently opposed to even
trying
this great horse at the distance that most other great National Hunt horses make their name.
Mike
And if your respected and highly successful (especially at the festival) trainer said to you "I have no doubt whatsoever that Bobs Worth/Long Run will outstay SS in the King George/Gold Cup", what would you do then?
Genius or not, if I were the owner I’d seek the second opinions of distant unbiased third parties rather more likely to offer a neutral, detached and objective assessment than the trainer
Perhaps Mr Mould should subscribe to TRF, though being of relatively advanced years he probably hasn’t got too much hair left to tear out
Honestly, some of the arguments on this thread for opposing an attempt at 3 miles – he’s a 2-miler, he’ll die if he runs at 3m, he might get tired, it might upset other owners – are just some of the most bizarre I’ve ever read.
Of course, he may not stay 3m effectively, in which case all of the above is null and void.
I’m not saying that Sprinter Sacre is a three-mile horse
. But I’m highly surprised that so many seem vehemently opposed to even
trying
this great horse at the distance that most other great National Hunt horses make their name.
Mike
I’ve never said I’m against trying him at 3 miles but some of us do not bow to the belief that a horse has to run over 3 miles to be considered a true great.
Best Mate won 3 Gold Cups but isn’t held in the regard that merits because he was apparently wrapped in cotton wool and didn’t give weight away to inferior horses – which I would guess is more of a neccesity when faced with numerous challenges over a trip that would strecth a horse’s stamina.
My comment about finishing tired was taken slightly out of context. What I mean is what is wrong with him dominating his current division for years to come, beating away every Arkle winner et al that comes along with the contemptous ease he has shown his "peers" thus far ?
It would have been a bit like saying to Sugar Ray Robinson "You know what Sugar Ray ?, these welter and middle weights are too easy for you, let’s take on Marciano."
As it happens the great boxer did step up albeit, only to light heavyweight. The fight took it’s toll, "tired" from the heat he suffered the only knockout of his career and was subsequently retired before a miserable comeback.
Lee
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