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. . . when you think about it, that IS the Flat season. Inordinate build up, unfit horses, insulting results, all multiplied with a wet spring. Then you have the good bit, then before you know it, it’s back end and the insulting results start again.
Perhaps not the most positive way of looking at it. Surely the build up is as much a part of the action as the peak?
The classics , the 2yo , the sprints , middle and long, not to mention the all weather!
I’ll bet that you haven’t gone over every single race replay? And if you haven’t, then my friend, you have missed loads!
To be Frank, it is light at the end of the tunnel. I am drained from flat racing. The sleepless nights, and the sleepless days. I love flat racing, but if you really throw your self at the season you’ll find it impossible to keep up and more than long enough.
Insulting results?
If you think it is over, you have from now until April next year ,to try and catch everything you missed!
You aint backed another loser Prof?
Insulting results? Explain please.When the jumping programme is all about 4 days in March; I guess Flat Racing should be glad it has "6 to 8 weeks".
Frankel & all, and you still moan Prof.
There’s no pleasing some people.Value Is EverythingI found professor on youtube
I found professor on youtube
Uncanny – me too!
You aint backed another loser Prof?
Insulting results? Explain please.When the jumping programme is all about 4 days in March; I guess Flat Racing should be glad it has "6 to 8 weeks".
Frankel & all, and you still moan Prof.
There’s no pleasing some people.I noticed Richard Birch in the Racing Post describe this season as the flattest of Flat seasons.
Frankel is a joy: but unknown to the general public. That tells you everything you need to know about where flat racing is now.
Insulting results: I know your schtick. In your book no result is insulting, unusual, or ever to be complained about. So thanks, but I don’t want to hear it again.
My idea of insulting results are not winners you can’t find but horses for example not winning class 4s and 3s then winning class 2s off 19lb heavier marks with no discernible ground or trip advantages. Things like that. Then there’s backend bollox. You know perfectly well what I’m talking about. You have to be able to think you’ve got a chance. Otherwise you might as well play roulette: and that’s exactly what a lot of punters are doing.My idea of insulting results are not winners you can’t find but horses for example not winning class 4s and 3s then winning class 2s off 19lb heavier marks with no discernible ground or trip advantages. Things like that.
Sounds unlikely.
A few examples maybe?
Rob
Sounds like someone has got the dreaded "favorite syndrome" .
Stop backing those short price favorites, and then stop moaning. Racing doesn’t need another moaner.
Sounds like someone has got the dreaded "favorite syndrome" .
Stop backing those short price favorites, and then stop moaning. Racing doesn’t need another moaner.
Completely wrong. I rarely back a horse under 5/1. 10/3 is my absolute shortest. I stay in profit by backing bigger prices. I cannot remember when I last backed a favourite.
My idea of insulting results are not winners you can’t find but horses for example not winning class 4s and 3s then winning class 2s off 19lb heavier marks with no discernible ground or trip advantages. Things like that.
Sounds unlikely.
A few examples maybe?
Rob
I have PMed Rob this horse, just so the forum knows.
I don’t want to mention individual horses and trainers on the forum because it’s bad form and someone will inevitably say I’m libelling, and I don’t want all that because I am making no suggestion of criminality. I find a result such as ******** in the ********* a bit pissing. As far as I can see he was 17lb worse off than his previous win in a Class 4 ten months previous. OK, OK, i accept he’d been running well in Class 2S at times. But in my Saturday morning form study (2 hrs) his form says: well in the grip of the handicapper.
How convenient.
You’re not going to mention the horse.
Why bother mentioning anything if you don’t want a discussion Prof?There are no qualifiers to your statistics Prof.
Value Is EverythingMark
It’s up to ‘The Prof’ if he wants to tell you the name. The horse in question did win a Class 4 as its previous win before the Class 2 win, however…
In its next run, its last of 2012, it was 3rd of 16 in a Listed race
Picking up this season, it was a length second of 13 in Class 3.
Then it was 0.75 lengths 3rd of 13 in a Class 2 Hcap.
3rd of 6 in a Beverley stakes race won by a subsequent Class 2 winner, first three rated 97, 110 and 97.
7th of 11 in a Class 2 beaten 4 lengths.
4th of 14 btn 1.75 lengths in a Class 2 Handicap, then won a Class 2 by a neck.Taking two runs in isolation it went from a Class 4 win to a Class 2 win rising 17lbs. Sorting through the form it was steadily progressive over that period in better than Class 4, including Class 2, and the Class 2 win was no particular surprise.
I saw this horse at Musselburgh last September and noted that he was ‘a big animal who probably found this five furlongs just too sharp’. Not a surprise in my opinion that he was up to winning a decent sprint over a galloping 6 furlongs.
Rob
Thanks for that Rob.
Hate to think what Prof will think of Farhh’s "improvement" if he wins a Group 1; only being a Handicapper and all that.
Value Is EverythingYes, I recall Farhh being referred to here as ‘that Thirsk handicap winner’, at a time when he had notched up places in 4 consecutive Group 1 races.
Rob
Mark
It’s up to ‘The Prof’ if he wants to tell you the name. The horse in question did win a Class 4 as its previous win before the Class 2 win, however…
In its next run, its last of 2012, it was 3rd of 16 in a Listed race
Picking up this season, it was a length second of 13 in Class 3.
Then it was 0.75 lengths 3rd of 13 in a Class 2 Hcap.
3rd of 6 in a Beverley stakes race won by a subsequent Class 2 winner, first three rated 97, 110 and 97.
7th of 11 in a Class 2 beaten 4 lengths.
4th of 14 btn 1.75 lengths in a Class 2 Handicap, then won a Class 2 by a neck.Taking two runs in isolation it went from a Class 4 win to a Class 2 win rising 17lbs. Sorting through the form it was steadily progressive over that period in better than Class 4, including Class 2, and the Class 2 win was no particular surprise.
I saw this horse at Musselburgh last September and noted that he was ‘a big animal who probably found this five furlongs just too sharp’. Not a surprise in my opinion that he was up to winning a decent sprint over a galloping 6 furlongs.
Rob
Did you back it?
I stand by my point that it wasn’t leaping out and that my conclusion was a fair one. I must find out which race had the most prize money. He is just
an example
of what punters are up against. Personally, I think these big field sprints are the rather unseemly way the industry juices its lower rank supporters, but as Ginger would say, what do i know?
Prof
Saving you the reasearch, the race that the horse won was a £37k race, worth a good deal more than the races it had contested previously. But then £37k handicaps don’t coem along everyday, so I would hazard a guess that most in the field were stepping up in race value after losing last time. Incidentally the winner turned round form with the second by about a length a pound better terms. The two are clearly evenly matched and on top of their form. The winner had been placed first 4 in 7 out of its last 9 races, not exactly one hiding its light under a bushel.
I note that the winner stepped up in race value to finish a fair 7th of 26 in £75k race last Saturday, which was won by a non-winner this season. But then since this was the most valuable sprint handicap in Europe it’s hardly surprising that a last time loser stepped up to win a race of greater value.
I didn’t back the horse, since for my own reasons I haven’t been betting on the flat this season partly due to lack of time to seriously commit. Sprint handicaps aren’t my cup of tea in the main, but some swear by them in the same way that my eyes light up if I see a 20-runner handicap hurdle during the NH season.
I suppose we could have 5 runner non-handicaps with 1/3 favourites winning on a regular basis. Presumably you would be on here complaining abotu races being uncompetitive. Still, some aren’t happy unless they have something to complain about!
Just a thought. 26 runners competed in the Ayr Gold Cup last Saturday, and something had to finish last (Cheviot as it happens). Does that make Cheviot a poor horse? Of course not, it was just slowest of 26 that turned up on the day!
Rob
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