Sir Erec

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This topic contains 25 replies, has 16 voices, and was last updated by  Rocky88 5 days, 2 hours ago.

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  • #1402739

    gamble
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    • Total Posts 2671

    Well I have only just found this and delaying my coffee to write here. Well this was the only race I had time to watch from the festival meeting and on ITV. It was a very sad event and if I had to stand on one leg for a long time it could stress my other leg and yes I was also interested which leg broke and if it was the re-shoed one and I may look again but have no recording. I don’t know why these legs break. Could an injection of speed an enouragement from the jockey do it ?

    I echo the sentiments of everyone here that it was a sad shadow that cast itself.

    #1402745

    gamble
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    David Sykes from the equine heath exec said the shoeing ( and he infers three legged standing for what was I suggest three minutes )had no effect on the subsequent injury.

    The animal aid rep said there was no time after the shoeing to see if Sir Erec was suitably fit to run and I have difficulty joining those dots. Why would losing a shoe have any effect on a horse’s fitness or can a loose shoe do any damage ?

    #1402748
    Ex RubyLight
    Ex RubyLight
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    • Total Posts 1164

    Gamble, what I’d like to know is, if the new shoe/plate is 100% identical with the replaced one. I can’t imagine that there is a “one size fits all” plate and that’s why I wonder if the new shoe is as good as the original one or if it makes a difference in the end. Otherwise all horses would wear universal sized shoes. Why would they? Humans have different feet so do horses, I would say.
    And it is interesting to note that the broken leg was the one that had to be reshod and it was the one with the bruise prior to the race. Maybe it was the new shoe that had him run and jump a bit differently than usual, maybe it wasn’t.

    #1402759

    gamble
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    • Total Posts 2671

    Thank you for the finer detail Ex Ruby and excellent thoughts. I did not know there was bruising and I have brought this possibly appropriately, under the Chelenham banner.

    #1402773

    greenasgrass
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    • Total Posts 1837

    Think the horse was reshod with the cast shoe after knocking the bend out of it. It’s not unusual to see a horse getting a plate put back on at the start. As for 3 minutes extra weight bearing on the other leg- sharing weight with the hindlimbs in a standing riderless horse- pah. Front legs take the full weight of the horse+jockey landing from a height over every fence. Just before the flight phase of a galloping horse, the leading forelimb briefly takes all the weight. Reading the stewards reports, loads of horses lost shoes during the various races; one lost both hind shoes.

    The reshoeing had nothing to do with it. The inbreeding might have. Otherwise just bad luck.

    #1402787

    gamble
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    • Total Posts 2671

    Thinking again, the single foreleg down could possibly be sharing one third of the weight, so effectively 23.33 stones rather than half or 35 stones – but only if the horses three legs were arranged like a three legged table and equally supporting the whole weight which they are not. It will be somewhere between those two weight pressures.
    I appreciate there is much greater weight with a jockey attached and from a height putting a lot more weight on the the leading foreleg on landing, but this is for just a half a second. I would need to see Xrays CT scans and MRI to fully establish how the tendons are stressed during the shoeing to guage effect, and greenasgrass creep out to your narrow hallway and stand on one leg, holding an egg timer , and see how cooked you feel, and then after directly running a couple of miles.

    I do concede you are most likely right as you have looked at the statistical outcomes and thank you for your time and views.

    There is a lot of work being done in America by vetinary scientists in this area of foreleg and backleg injury. They look at the pressures and frequency of high speed training and use x rays and the other diagnostics. Also the effect of racing surfaces testing by attaching stress meters. They look at defects in forleg conformity in young horses, and either correcting, or preventing damage (not running). They examine the effects of arthritis and osteoporosis in young and older horses and test senstivities and vulnerability to injury. Racing farms do not all carry diagnistic tools but more are equipping themselves and some have transit borrowing arrangements.

    Quarter back high speed horses in Califirnia sustain proportionately more leg injuries than ordinary racing thoroughbreds, I suggest because of more speed.

    My little quarter back fella, just stands on an old victorian mahogany table with brass castors, and only moves when he’s dusted.

    #1402789

    greenasgrass
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    • Total Posts 1837

    greenasgrass creep out to your narrow hallway and stand on one leg, holding an egg timer , and see how cooked you feel, and then after directly running a couple of miles.

    I’ll give it a lash….but only if you have a go at sleeping standing up first. (hint: you might need to install some form of stay apparatus).

    #1402808

    gamble
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    • Total Posts 2671

    Birds sleep when they are standing up, and I know because I have watched them secretly and possibly fakirs have it under their belt.

    Horses do stand a lot so three minutes on three legs should be done with three whistles. :whistle:

    I may try your challenge greenasgrass – Churchill could do it sitting down so it would be a case of check head is above the parapet check standing straight as an arrow in said trench and just wait for my shot .

    #1417694

    Rocky88
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    • Total Posts 2

    First time post guys, so go easy……

    Iv’e let the dust settle on the terrible incident involving Sir Erec before posting on here, but a few things have been nagging away at me.

    Prior to the race – The stone bruise and losing the shoe on the way to the start line. Now i fully accept that Sir Erec had scans leading up to the race but clearly this hampered his preparation and its dubious or not if he was still ‘feeling’ it. Coupled with him getting reshod seconds before starting the race, it doesn’t sit very well with me. I have read that he was ‘checked’ after being reshod, i would highly dispute this. The only check would have been him trotting over to the start line to the other horses. No person could have made a professional call in that time.

    Race – Sir Erec ran a very messy first few hurdles before reaching his final hurdle. I think he only cleanly jumped 1. Approaching his last hurdle he slowed considerably and almost looked reluctant to jump. I don’t believe it was a pure ‘freak accident’. I believe he was ‘carrying’ a problem which upset his rhythm when running and particularly jumping.

    I just feel lots of little things added up to his downfall which potentially could of been avoided.

    Just wanted to hear other people’s views not the dust has settled.

    #1417697

    homersimpson
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    • Total Posts 2063

    Welcome to the forum Rocky.

    If I was up to it I would watch the race again but don’t think I can, even up to the point of the incident. You could have a point Rocky but there is a good deal of hindsight in your comments. It was the last thing I expected to see happen :cry:

    #1417698

    Rocky88
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    • Total Posts 2

    Thanks HS.

    No, its not an easy 2nd watch for anyone.

    I get that hindsight would be ideal in many of these situations. I just feel that in Sir Erec’s case he had a few little indicators that all add up to essentially being a NR or pulled up.

    Tragic all round, but i cant help feel he was let down on the balance of the evidence.

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