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At another request, here are the Group 1 winners STS beat in his Group 1 races… will be updated as the season progresses
2000 Guineas
Rip Van Winkle- Susses Stakes (2009), Queen Elizabeth II Stakes (2009), Juddmonte International Stakes (2010)
Mastercraftsman- Phoenix Stakes (2008), National Stakes (2008), Irish 2000 Guineas (2009), St James Palace Stakes (2009)
Lord Shanakill- Prix Jean Prat (2009)Epsom Derby
Fame And Glory- Criterium de Saint-Cloud (2008), Irish Derby (2009), Tattersalls Gold Cup (2010), Coronation Cup (2010)
Rip Van Winkle- Susses Stakes (2009), Queen Elizabeth II Stakes (2009), Juddmonte International Stakes (2010)
Crowded House- Racing Post Trophy (2008)
Debussy- Arlington Million (2010)Eclipse Stakes
Rip Van Winkle- Susses Stakes (2009), Queen Elizabeth II Stakes (2009), Juddmonte International Stakes (2010)
Conduit- St Leger Stakes (2008), Breeders Cup Turf (2008), King George VI & Queen Elizabeth Stakes (2009), Breeders Cup Turf (2009)
Cima De Triomphe- Derby Italiano (2008)
Jukebox Jury- Preis Von Europa (2009)
Twice Over- Champion Stakes (2009), Eclipse Stakes (2010)Juddmonte International Stakes
Mastercraftsman- Phoenix Stakes (2008), National Stakes (2008), Irish 2000 Guineas (2009), St James Palace Stakes (2009)Irish Champion Stakes
Fame And Glory- Criterium de Saint-Cloud (2008), Irish Derby (2009), Tattersalls Gold Cup (2010), Coronation Cup (2010)
Mastercraftsman- Phoenix Stakes (2008), National Stakes (2008), Irish 2000 Guineas (2009), St James Palace Stakes (2009)
Casual Conquest- Tattersalls Gold Cup (2009)Prix de l’Arc de Triomphe
Youmzain- Preis Von Europa (2006), Grand Prix de Saint-Cloud (2008)
Cavalyman- Grand Prix de Paris (2009)
Conduit- St Leger Stakes (2008), Breeders Cup Turf (2008), King George VI & Queen Elizabeth Stakes (2009), Breeders Cup Turf (2009)
Dar Re Mi- Pretty Polly Stakes (2009), Yorkshire Oaks (2009), Dubai Sheema Classic (2010)
Fame And Glory- Criterium de Saint-Cloud (2008), Irish Derby (2009), Tattersalls Gold Cup (2010), Coronation Cup (2010)
Stacelita- Prix Saint-Alary (2009), Prix de Diane (2009), Prix Vermeille (2009), Prix Jean Romanet (2010)
Vision D’Etat- Prix Du Jockey Club (2008), Prix Ganay (2009), Prince of Wales Stakes (2009), Hong Kong Cup (2009)
Getaway- Deutschland-Preis (2009), Preis Von Baden (2009)
Hot Six- Grande Premio (2009)All together, 18 Group 1 winners of 40 Group 1 races
I would be interested to know what you meant by “At another request …”. If it was to back up the notion that Sea The Stars was a great champion, I am not sure that it adds anything. By coincidence, before this year’s Eclipse Stakes I totted up the number of of Group 1 winners Twice Over had beaten since his win in last year’s Champion Stakes, to counter an argument that he was ordinary. It turned out that he had beaten 19 Group 1 winners since last October, and in his two subsequent races he has added another four. I can’t quite see Twice Over in the same class as Sea The Stars. If it seems that form lines are sometimes contradictatory, then statistics are even more puzzling.
K already done a list for Goldikova. Someone was interested in seeing the Sea The Stars one.
Zenjah asked me for more after the Goldikova article, hence the one for Zarkava and STS. I’ve done this for many other top class horses, including some American ones (Zenyatta’s may cause a few debates), so if anyone wants a specific horse I can put an article up.
That’s interesting about Twice Over. I’m assuming the majority of those were in the Champion Stakes… just for comparison purposes, I only include those beaten in Group 1 races, and only if the subject of the article won. Therefore I don’t count horses like Raven’s Pass (beaten in the Craven Stakes) or Byword (beaten in the Juddmonte but also beaten by RVW), so I may come up with a different figure to you.
TWICE OVER
Champion Stakes (2009)
Sariska- Epsom Oaks (2009), Irish Oaks (2009)
Fame And Glory- Criterium de Saint-Cloud (2008), Irish Derby (2009), Tattersalls Gold Cup (2010), Coronation Cup (2010)
Virtual- Lockinge Stakes (2009)
Campanologist- Grosser Preis (2010), Rheinland-Pokal (2010)
Never On Sunday- Prix d’Ispahan (2009)
Alpine Rose- Prix Jean Romanet (2009)Eclipse Stakes (2010)
Dar Re Mi- Pretty Polly Stakes (2009), Yorkshire Oaks (2009), Dubai Sheema Classic (2010)Only 7 Group 1 winners of 14 Group 1 races by my count
Aha, word of warning. I’m using RacingPost, which I’m not sure has records from before 1987, as I could only compile half of Miesque’s races. I’ll see what I can do.
Re: Twice Over
When I compiled the list I was not aware of your method of inluding only races that the subject won. Even though all the Twice Over races were Group 1 (Champion Stakes, Breeders Cup Classic, Dubai World Cup, Prince of Wales Stakes), he only won the first of those.
Re: Twice Over
When I compiled the list I was not aware of your method of inluding only races that the subject won. Even though all the Twice Over races were Group 1 (Champion Stakes, Breeders Cup Classic, Dubai World Cup, Prince of Wales Stakes), he only won the first of those.
No worries, I didn’t explain how I calculated it. I just figured it would take a lot longer to record all Group 1 winners in all races regardless of the outcome. I did this initially for Goldikova as I was interested in the opposition she had faced in winning her 10 Group 1’s (a remarkable achievement), then just carried on with that method. It just seems fairest to me, as beating other horses in a race won by another horse doesn’t really count, and beating them in lesser races might indicate a drop in form, a prep race or races at the beginning of a horses career, all circumstances that might not see competitors at their best.
Anddddd Debussy just beat Gio Ponti in the Arlington Million (made me laugh!) to add another string to STS’ bow
It’s a good measure, but comparing the G1 winners beaten in non G1 races would be dangerous. Not an issue for the greats, but would confuse the issue with the likes of Twice Over.
It’s a good measure, but comparing the G1 winners beaten in non G1 races would be dangerous. Not an issue for the greats, but would confuse the issue with the likes of Twice Over.
My thoughts exactly. Especially in two year old races where future Group 1 winners could be defeated by a non-Group 1 winner.
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