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QEII

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  • #4122
    Aragorn
    Member
    • Total Posts 2208

    Anyone else think this horse is being underrated again? He tends not to go off much shorter than about 5/1 yet has proved himself well up to G1 class this year, unlucky in defeat once and then won next time up.. Good turn of foot and has proved himself at Ascot (when unlucky in defeat).. I think the only thing that will put me off is if the ground comes up softer than good.. I would fear Librettist the most.

    George was primed for the guineas and i’m not sure he’ll be able to beat the older horses.. Araafa was firmly put in his place last time up, which throws doubt on the quality of the 3yo’s.

    #96639
    davidjohnson
    Member
    • Total Posts 4491

    I would have a concern as to whether the Sussex Stakes should be interprted literally. Most people are of the opinion, (and I’m one of them) that Echo of Light and Araafa raced too close to what was an overly-strong pace. Therefore they were at a disadvantage. Court Masterpiece was dropped right out and had the race run to suit in ideal fashion. I’m not syaing he isn’t a consistent and high-class performer. Clearly he is, but I would not be dismissing Araafa on that one run. Echo of Light showed it all wrong when he ran next time in the Strensall.

    #96640
    Aragorn
    Member
    • Total Posts 2208

    Personally I think Echo of Light is a very good G3 horse capable of winning a G2 but doesn’t quite cut it at this level. He ran pretty freely in front in the strensall as well but appeared to stay the trip that day as he didn’t have the same class of horse chasing him.

    Take the point about Araafa and Frankie will probably set a steadier pace on Librettist who isn’t the nutter that Echo seems to be so he’ll probably be a lot closer this time.

    I would also prefer Spencer not to be on board as, good as he is, he always seems to find trouble in the big races. Concerned about Kinane on George W as well, but he’s had the benefit of riding him now so that may be diminished.

    Great race anyway, winner must surely be Europe’s best miler?

    #96641
    SirHarryLewis
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1208

    Strong evidence that Court Masterpiece is a better horse at Goodwood.  I wouldnt rule out his chance thought and he could run very well but I  think Librettist and the favourite  will deserve lots of respect

    SHL

    #96643
    Aragorn
    Member
    • Total Posts 2208

    I thought he would have won at Ascot if he’d had a clear run, or at least been very close. If he had won, I think he would be much shorter. Ad valorem has only been beaten once on good/firm ground, by Shamardal (no shame in that) so is obviously a very good horse given his ground and there were some good horses behind CM that day.

    I’m not hugely confident but I think he’s the value in the race. Although I think Librettist is 100/30 in some places which is also value.

    I just can’t help thinkin that GW was trained and primed for the guineas and we won’t see him run to that level again. O’Brien is hardly shouting from the rooftops, "gone the right way" is not the most positive report i’ve ever heard about the horse. If his price comes crashing down on the day though you’d have to be wary.<br>

    #96644
    The Market Man
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    • Total Posts 396

    George Washington should be bang on this time after his comeback run. He’s too short to back but I wouldn’t be wanting to back anything to beat him to be honest.

    #96646
    Librettist
    Member
    • Total Posts 559

    Quote: from Aragorn on 12:25 pm on Sep. 19, 2006[br]I would fear Librettist the most.

    <br>

    Don’t fear me, I am not sure this stiff mile will be right up my street – especially if the ground comes up softer than good, and I have had lots of hard races in quick succession:(

    #96647
    Aidan
    Member
    • Total Posts 1198

    especially if the ground comes up softer than good

    You have said this before but connections have said he loves it soft and indeed he won his first Group 1 in bottomless conditions. Was less impressive last time on better going.

    #96648
    Librettist
    Member
    • Total Posts 559

    I’m only saying that for this particular race as I am not sure that he will see out Ascot’s stiff mile if there is soft ground. He was tiring close home on his penultimate start and also to a degree on his last run. He clearly handles cut but he has also shown he handles quicker ground too. Interestingly connections blamed his defeat as a 2yo in the Dewhurst on the ground being soft but personally I think it was a combination of that and the 7f that did for him back then. Just my opinion – hope I am proved wrong…! If it’s good or better i’ll back him.

    #96650
    Aidan
    Member
    • Total Posts 1198

    If the ground is fast, George will blow them away….a 130 performance on the cards on Saturday granted fastish ground. There can nor will be any excuses on Saturday.

    #96653
    clivex
    Member
    • Total Posts 3420

    spot on trackside

    Suely though, if Gw runs like he can, thats it really….

    Going down to see him (bet hes looking forward to it)and im not even sure that 6/4 is bad value….

    EC are you going to leave the house and be there? ;)

    Araafa i feel is much better than that last run

    #96654
    jackane24
    Member
    • Total Posts 444

    He’d probably claim the race was run slowly EC……;)

    Have to agree with Aidan – I see nothing coming close to GW. I think Araafa has been quite overrated, I don’t see Proclamation as a G1 horse, Librettist needs it soft PLUS will be challenged for the lead.<br>Court Masterpiece is a Goodwood specialist and will be too weak over a strongly run mile.

    And people reckon Aidan O’Brien primed him for the Guineas and won’t be back near his best? Ha. O’Brien is a horse racing genius. Not one trainer comes close to his quality.

    #96656
    davidbrady
    Member
    • Total Posts 3901

    I’d prefer Araafa to GW at the prices. Any horse who wins 2 x Gr1s on GF and Hvy is very difficult to oppose. And a CD winner to boot. The older horses don’t look up to much apart from Librettist who won’t get his soft ground so at the current 7.6 on BF, it’s Araafa for me.

    #96657
    FlatSeasonLover
    Member
    • Total Posts 2065

    EC people might get the wrong idea if you are not careful!

    GEORGE WASHINGTON is not a horse I like to back and I haven’t done during his career so far but I will do on Saturday. The horse was clearly too fresh last time and wouldn’t settle (I’ve written this all before) but to finsih 3rd was a good effort. I think he will take all the beating  in the QE II as long as the horse has been prepared for the race (and if you can’t trust O’Brien who can you trust?)

    #96658
    clivex
    Member
    • Total Posts 3420

    jackane…think weve been down this route before but how isnt proclamation a group one horse? simply not true….

    Personally i think afew trainers come close to or are even stronger than AOB 9although that doesnt atke anything away from him…). Stoute for one….

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