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You’re not Tanya Stevenson in disguise are you Steve
He’s not but I’ll let you into a little secret I am in actually fact in disguise, I’m not really Nathan but
French Liz…..
Blackbeard to conquer the World
<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>stevecaution wrote:</div>
Pricewise tipped Legatissimo at 10/1 for today.Clearly a numpty who hasn’t got a clue
Yes, best to concentrate on the horse returning 10 points and conveniently forget about the 11 points frittered away on other horses over the weekend.
Hopefully not much damage was done and as little was put on the losers as was allowed on the winner
You’re not Tanya Stevenson in disguise are you Steve
Tipping horses is a very difficult task. You can study for ages and watch your horse tailed off for no apparent reason, eg Ol’ Man River and Jellicle Ball were two examples over the weekend for me, 20/1 into 6/1 and 40/1 into 7/1 and I never had a prayer of collecting having got the value long ago.
There’s obviously a bit of leeway given to Pricewise and a bit of jiggery pokery on occasion as well. I don’t like that fact but there have some great tips put up in the column and you have to acknowledge that fact.
Other people are better tipsters than me but I just post my own thoughts and sometimes come up with the odd good winner. I try to follow a logical process and avoid bad value favourites but it doesn’t always bring a winner, even when the bad favourite gets stuffed along the way.
Steve isn’t my real name but it’s not Tanya either. Normally it’s David or Davey, Dave is only borderline acceptable and I was once called Davvidy…Davvidy…Davvidy by a drunk man during the final of the local snooker doubles where three of the four participants were called David. We won by the way, David and David, beating David and Kenny, my 26 break proving crucial
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
‘Twas ever thus – even in the Mark Coton days winners were being claimed at prices you couldn’t obtain.
Doesn’t stop it being an interesting read and all the time Segal can come out with insightful lines like “everyone used to say the Grand National was a lottery when it wasn’t – the tough fences meant you could narrow the field down to ten who could jump round. Now the fences are easier it is a bigger lottery than ever” his views are worth reading.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"His pick(s) for the Derby are due in tomorrow’s Racing Post.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
‘Twas ever thus – even in the Mark Coton days winners were being claimed at prices you couldn’t obtain.
Doesn’t stop it being an interesting read and all the time Segal can come out with insightful lines like “everyone used to say the Grand National was a lottery when it wasn’t – the tough fences meant you could narrow the field down to ten who could jump round. Now the fences are easier it is a bigger lottery than ever” his views are worth reading.
Insightful? You didn’t know that about the GN without reading it in Tom’s column?
Nothing wrong with having a column but pricewise is pointless. When prices are returned from the track they are supposed to be available to good money, that’s nowhere near the case with a lot of fictional prices given out by Pricewise.
The prices were more readily available in Coton’s day and even since, so Pricewise & Beat the Book had a place.
Bookmakers like Betway, Betfair Sportsbook, Bet 365, Boyles, Powers and Chandlers will not lay bets to anyone with knowledge or who might win. They only want losers. Of course the Big 4 will let you have a small amount in shops only but since FOBT’s are less inclined to do so.
Pity bookmakers don’t put an end to the farce by following Powers lead. They no longer lay Pricewise prices for a period in the morning and state “The landscape has changed a lot unlike the early days of Pricewise when we used to fax our prices across and wait until the next day to see what would happen, we now have almost all races priced up and traded overnight. It doesn’t make much sense to put up out of date prices for a 5 minute period the following morning”.
They might not lay a decent bet but at least they have got that right and the sooner other bookies follow suit the better.
Don’t know why so many people are in denial, it’s a fact of life.
Christophermarlowe 16/1 Steve. You should be able to get something on with it being ante post particularly with Ladbrokes
Christophermarlowe 16/1 Steve. You should be able to get something on with it being ante post particularly with Ladbrokes
Christophermarlowe is in to 14/1 already. Luckily for me I am on already at 33/1, advised over on the Big Races section. The advantages of being a small stakes, fun, punter and staying one step ahead of Pricewise, who scours my posts and those of The Ante Post King for the crumbs.
Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.
Insightful? You didn’t know that about the GN without reading it in Tom’s column?
Nothing wrong with having a column but pricewise is pointless. When prices are returned from the track they are supposed to be available to good money, that’s nowhere near the case with a lot of fictional prices given out by Pricewise.
The prices were more readily available in Coton’s day and even since, so Pricewise & Beat the Book had a place.
Bookmakers like Betway, Betfair Sportsbook, Bet 365, Boyles, Powers and Chandlers will not lay bets to anyone with knowledge or who might win. They only want losers. Of course the Big 4 will let you have a small amount in shops only but since FOBT’s are less inclined to do so.
Pity bookmakers don’t put an end to the farce by following Powers lead. They no longer lay Pricewise prices for a period in the morning and state “The landscape has changed a lot unlike the early days of Pricewise when we used to fax our prices across and wait until the next day to see what would happen, we now have almost all races priced up and traded overnight. It doesn’t make much sense to put up out of date prices for a 5 minute period the following morning”.
They might not lay a decent bet but at least they have got that right and the sooner other bookies follow suit the better.
Don’t know why so many people are in denial, it’s a fact of life.
Think it is you who’s “in denial” here Yeats.
Pricewise is a victim of his own success. Coton was less successful than Segal. If Tom was not exceptional at tipping – then bookmakers would lay the advertised price all day. As it is – having no option but to severely limit the amount of time top prices are available and amount they’ll let someone bet. You say they’re “supposed to be available to good money”. No, Pricewise horses are not! They’re for the fiver and tenner punters, not a column for “good money” bettors at all. You say these prices are “fictional”, but if the price was not subject to Tom’s tip – it would not shorten so quickly (if at all); therefore not “fictional”.Bookmaker’s odds compilers evaluate form so bookmakers can give competitive Early prices in the morning. Tom gets those Morning odds and looks for a value price. Bookmakers – knowing Tom is an exceptional judge – realise they’ve made a mistake. Whenever bookmakers realise any mistake they will alter prices accordingly.
Value Is EverythingIf pricewise was a guy sitting at home betting on betfair and makign the selections he does he’d be making a killing. But Tom says ‘I’m a better tipster than punter’ and he clearly enjoys the puzzle rather than the chasing of cash. Tipping is a totally different psychological pursuit to punting in my opinion. When your own money is down, or when a losing streak is looking like it may wipe your bank out, logic and rationale can go out the window along with objectivity and patience.
Think it is you who’s “in denial” here Yeats.
Pricewise is a victim of his own success. Coton was less successful than Segal. If Tom was not exceptional at tipping – then bookmakers would lay the advertised price all day. As it is – having no option but to severely limit the amount of time top prices are available and amount they’ll let someone bet. You say they’re “supposed to be available to good money”. No, Pricewise horses are not! They’re for the fiver and tenner punters, not a column for “good money” bettors at all. You say these prices are “fictional”, but if the price was not subject to Tom’s tip – it would not shorten so quickly (if at all); therefore not “fictional”.Bookmaker’s odds compilers evaluate form so bookmakers can give competitive Early prices in the morning. Tom gets those Morning odds and looks for a value price. Bookmakers – knowing Tom is an exceptional judge – realise they’ve made a mistake. Whenever bookmakers realise any mistake they will alter prices accordingly.
[/quote]My views have followed extensive research of betting forums while yours appear to be based on personal opinion and a flawed one at that.
fyi Lots of 5 and 10 pound bets equates to good money. But in lots of cases lots of 5 and 10 pound bets do not take place particularly with the bookmakers I named. The big 4 do some in their shops.
You even admit yourself that some of the prices are fictional as you say that when they realise they have made a “mistake” as you call it they alter it.
I’m still awaiting evidence from you or others that some of these bookmakers, Betfair Sportsbook, Boylesports, Betway etc continually take Pricewise bets even for a few quid.
I find it odd that so many praise Pricewise on here but so few follow it with hard earned? Why is that? Don’t they want to win money or do they prefer to lose money on their own selections? Its free money according to admin.
Powers statement is correct.
I’d imagine most people praising Pricewise do so for the methodology, not the (non existent) returns to “good money”. Anyone with half a clue takes Pricewise for what it is – a bookmaker supported recreational punter corralling tool. And anything that brings more recreational money into horseracing betting markets is only a good thing.
From a betting theory point of view, there is plenty to be learnt from that column. From a punting point of view, the approximately 85% percent of Pricewise races where Segal doesn’t select the winner more often than not creates value on other runners in the same race, regularly at the front of the market and to decent money if you use the exchanges.
I’d love to hear more from Tom Segal in the racing media, he’s underused imo.
I would praise Pricewise for the good inciteful hard work that is obviously put in.
Personally I prefer it if me and pricewise don’t agree for some perverse reason!!
Generally speaking a place my bets the evening before so the prices available to me sometimes vary massively from the next mornings prices.
I have a friend who backs ALL pricewise selections admittedly to only £25 stakes but he gets on pretty much all the time. He doesn’t drive a Bugatti Veron though!!
Now you’re moving the goal posts for what “good money” means Yeats. Sometimes some of the big 4 may not lay as many fivers and tenners as they should of the top price, but that’s no arguement for its end. Of course it is not easy to get on at top price but some is available and odds a little shorter are still value anyway.
Tom gets what the Morning Prices will be through to him the evening before. Those are the morning prices, not “fictional” at all. You can say bookmakers don’t keep the Pricewise top price for long enough. Yes, because bookmakers realise they’ve made a mistake. And (this is important) because Tom’s tips dominate the first moments of very early trading, as punters try to get on before the price shortens. Bookmakers need to form a reasonably equal book to limit liabilities, therefore it stands to reason where a massive percentage of bets in a short period are for one big priced horse – it stands to reason the price won’t last long. Just as a massive percentage of bets for one big priced horse in any other short period would result in shortening odds. However, fact is the price was available for a short time and therefore NOT “fictional”.
Do you have evidence those bookmakers you quote do not lay Pricewise for “a few quid” Yeats? If there is evidence bookmkers do not lay any of the prices then they should obviously not be on the page.
I don’t personally “follow Pricewise”, because I am not a fiver/tenner punter and am successful with my own bets. Unfortunately it does not need to be a Pricewise tip for bookmakers to refuse bets.
Value Is EverythingLike Cav mentioned, the methodology behind Pricewise provided by Segal is still insightful and he is an exceptional racing brain.
Ginge, I don’t disagree with most of what you are saying, but the prices are not always available in the morning, Banzari was recommended at 8/1 on the Pricewise racing post column but the best odds in the morning were 7/1 with Coral and BetfairSB.
To the original point, is Pricewise past its sell by date? Maybe, it probably needs a re-think. In this digital age is a bit more difficult for it to be applicable to the recreational punter wanting their fiver or tenner on in the shop in the morning.
It still however remains true to the point though of value betting and provides plenty of insight for the reader.
Ginge, I don’t disagree with most of what you are saying, but the prices are not always available in the morning, Banzari was recommended at 8/1 on the Pricewise racing post column but the best odds in the morning were 7/1 with Coral and BetfairSB.
To the original point, is Pricewise past its sell by date? Maybe, it probably needs a re-think. In this digital age is a bit more difficult for it to be applicable to the recreational punter wanting their fiver or tenner on in the shop in the morning.
It still however remains true to the point though of value betting and provides plenty of insight for the reader.
It’s a good point and true that with bookmakers staying open all night, Early Prices being available at different times and this being the digital age – the top price is less available. So I’d agree Pricewise is “past its best by date”, not sell by date. Still relevent.
Who was the 8/1 Banzari supposedly available with tb?
Value Is EverythingBanzari was 8/1 with Bet365 last night if that’s any help. Not sure if anyone was eights this morning though.
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