The home of intelligent horse racing discussion
The home of intelligent horse racing discussion

no mention of ascot then?

Home Forums Horse Racing no mention of ascot then?

Viewing 10 posts - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #11644
    runandskip
    Member
    • Total Posts 412

    it seems at the moment that once again the derby wont be heading for the king george at ascot in july given mr oxx wanting to drop ses the stars back in trip.
    how sad it is that the king george has lost a lot of its sparkle,yes its still a good race but nothing like the midsummer showdown it used to be.
    the prize money has been upped to a million this year so what else can ascot do?

    #232467
    Gerald
    Member
    • Total Posts 4293

    If it is decided that the 3yos skip the race, I can live with that.

    There is also a repercussion of the Prix du Jockey-Club being reduced to 10f, and the Grand Prix de Paris, now held each year on Bastille Day July 14th, going back up to 12f. The latter is £250,000+ to the winner.

    If you’ve got a genuine 12f 3yo the plan now is Derby, Irish Derby, GPdP.

    I’m just pleased that we have an older filly, Look Here, that can take on the boys again, bringing back the days of Dahlia and Triptych.

    #232489
    douginho
    Member
    • Total Posts 1046

    Once again its all about stallion fees though. The derby and being a derby winner is not really about winning the greatest race on earth anymore. Its about ensuring the bloodline is very very very blue. And it seems breeders want top class milers, mile and a quarter horses, not top class Mile and a half horses. (Please see the Aidan O’Brien thread on main page re Rip Van Winkle being the "chosen" winner by Coolmore).

    Take John Oxx interviewed by the BBC after yesterdays race. He is a trainer for whom I have much respect. But how quick was he to dismiss the St Leger and therefore the Triple Crown? If it was purely about horse racing then surely the St Leger would be the next big day? But as the Leger is over 1m 6f (and a bit) then it gets the boot.

    He did suggest that he reckoned the triple crown would be won in the next 10 years but you have to question whether the triple crown will ever be won again. One possibility, and this is not what I want, is to change the Triple Crown. Might has well make it the Guineas, Derby and Juddmonte International at York. A top class race run over each of the three main distances of 1m, 1m 4f and 1m 2f.

    #232491
    Ian
    Member
    • Total Posts 1415

    I tend to agree with the opening post. There is little value in Sea The Stars winning the Irish Derby IMO I think he should go Eclipse / King George then break then Arc unless of course they want to go for the Triple Crown which looks unlikely.

    Sea The Stars vs Conduit vs Tartan Bearer at Ascot maybe vs a better ridden Fame And Glory also – thats the sort of racing I want to see.

    #232516
    Neil Watson
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1376

    They should go for the Triple Crown as this would give racing an even bigger story for the front pages and its the ideal platform to get new people into the sport.

    After all a 27yo Nightclub owner from Japan, I bet his club is now packed to the rafters with revellers enjoying this big win.

    #232521
    % MAN
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5104

    They should go for the Triple Crown as this would give racing an even bigger story for the front pages and its the ideal platform to get new people into the sport.

    But what is the point if, as looks very likely, the horse will not get the 1m 6f?

    You will face

    a) the prospect of damaging the horse

    and / or

    b) the publicity could well backfire if the horse trailed home last or was pulled up

    Nothing wrong with going for the Triple Crown if the horse has a live chance of winning it, but to do it for the sake of PR would be very dangerous imo.

    #232525
    douginho
    Member
    • Total Posts 1046

    But what is the point if, as looks very likely, the horse will not get the 1m 6f?

    You will face

    a) the prospect of damaging the horse

    and / or

    b) the publicity could well backfire if the horse trailed home last or was pulled up

    Nothing wrong with going for the Triple Crown if the horse has a live chance of winning it, but to do it for the sake of PR would be very dangerous imo.

    Its the St Leger, not the Grand National!

    The race is only 2f further than the Derby on a generally flat track so to answer your points: a) the horse was much more likely to get damaged in the Derby at Epsom than the St Leger; b) So in your opinion the horse will empty of gas so quick in the last 2f it will pull up?

    If your view is reflective of the racing establishment then its no wonder the St Leger is in decline.

    Granted if the ground was soft then dont go to Donny but on good or faster ground I see no reason why going to donny will be bad for the horse. The pace of the race will make the first mile of the race a mere gentle jog for Sea the Stars and the only unknown would be the final 2f. So STS could be 2f away from immortality…thats a chance I’d have to take if I was the owner.

    #232533
    Imperial Call
    Member
    • Total Posts 2184

    I tend to agree with the opening post.

    There is little value in Sea The Stars winning the Irish Derby IMO

    I think he should go Eclipse / King George then break then Arc unless of course they want to go for the Triple Crown which looks unlikely.

    Sea The Stars vs Conduit vs Tartan Bearer at Ascot maybe vs a better ridden Fame And Glory also – thats the sort of racing I want to see.

    I don’t think the trainer would agree with you. John Oxx trains on the Curragh and having the Derby winner there would I’m sure mean as much to him and Mick as having the horse win at Epsom.

    I’d say Irish Derby, Judmonte International, Champion Stakes at Leopardstown and the Breeders Cup Classic will be the most likely campaign for Sea The Stars now. It’ll depend a lot on the ground though.

    #232535
    Anonymous
    Inactive
    • Total Posts 17716

    The race is only 2f further than the Derby on a generally flat track

    It isn’t!
    It’s more than 2.5f further, on a much more galloping track, and generally on softer ground. Unfortunately, since the last Triple Crown winner, it does nothing at all for a horse’s stud prospects to win it, either.

    #232549
    wit
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2165

    After all a 27yo Nightclub owner from Japan…..

    like his parents David and Ling who raced and bred the dam Urban Sea, Chris Tsui is actually Hong Kong Chinese.

    his club is Miusik, 13th Floor, 2 – 6 Yee Woo Street, Causeway Bay, Hong Kong.

    in the interests of accuracy, and because mixing up the two nationalities is like mixing up English and French.

    also because the temptation may be there to take Sea The Stars to race Presvis at some stage in HK.

Viewing 10 posts - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.