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Prof,
Interesting to learn more about you. I have been studying journalism online, intermittently, over 5 years and I still haven’t passed Central or Local Gvnt. So, for the moment your powers are greater than mine.
However…
….I don’t think switching off the FOBTs results in Britain slowly becoming North Korea.I’m all for liberties and choice but a society does need some laws and protections. No, not shadowy, ostensible protection to keep the masses in their place…but reasonable one’s that make a society more bearable and humane.
I don’t think any political party has quite got the right balance since the beginning of time. Doesn’t mean it won’t happen!
I’m happy to go along with the belief that there are degrees of addictions. Plainly, some addictions are more dangerous than others and not lent to being moderate, manageable addictions. I probably am addicted to chocolate, I eat it almost every day, but it’s not ripping my life apart (my belt, maybe). Now if I started getting more heavily involved with FOBTs I have no doubt that could destroy my life quickly. Like cocaine or any other hardcore drug.
I choose not to partake to that degree, but I’m not that far away at times…so am I vulnerable or an idiot? Maybe I’m both.
What gamblers don’t need is something that can turn them into addicts so mercilessly. It’s just about greed, and isn’t that one of the biggest problems facing this earth?
I honestly don’t expect to win if I play the roulette or slots, I have very low expectations. It’s an expensive entertainment and I know it is dangerous…maybe that is the attraction, being near the edge, but I don’t honestly think so.
Should we ban cigarettes? Hmmm, I don’t think so. I don’t see any benefit from them but it is a choice. I see your point that they are destructive, but I also think the health risks are made very clear and someone who tries a cigarette is less likely to end up being destroyed than if they try the FOBT. That is my honest opinion, not backed up by any data, just opinion.
Perhaps if the regulation on the FOBTs was upgraded and there were large stickers saying "this machine is highly addictive and may lead to serious health and social problems" – that would be a positive step. At least people would be more informed.
As for your children, it sounds like you wouldn’t ostracise them or treat them with contempt if they were addicted to fruities/FOBTs. Personally, I think any addicted person should be afforded the same understanding that we offer those closest to us.
I read somewhere that being a journo is so stressful it has the highest suicide rate of all professions. Is that a myth?
Zip
You are Tony Blair and I claim the Daily Messenger prize.
My old man met some young guy coming out of the bookies earlier who lost £1000 in a FOBT. Given what the guy works as, i’m not so sure he will be taking much more money home with him. There is the argument that nobody forces people to play the machines, but i think the stronger argument is that the bookies are using these machines to pray on certain peoples weakness i.e an addictive personality trait.
Their addictive nature is certainly a key point, Superman.
What a great movie that was btw.
Zip
An important difference between these machines and say cigs or alcohol is cost – it’s difficult to spend all your wage on cigs and beer, unless you are a serious alcoholic in which case the signs will be very clear to friends and family. Even then spending £1000 will take a number of events over a period of time. A chap could spend all his wage on a betting machine in a couple of hours, in a single event. No time to consider.
I was at wolves races yesterday, very enjoyable by the way it’s a nice place. For those who haven’t been there is a ladbrokes betting shop right in the grandstand with 3 betting machines. There was a constant queue of people waiting to play, many seemingly oblivious to the racing environment. All young men. I watched a couple put in £20, place £20 of bets on roulette very thoughtfully and get £20.50 back. High fives we won £20.50! No lads, you won 50p. You risked £20 to win 50p. With a pub fruit machine you might risk 50p to win £50. Totally different dynamic. They also thought how they placed their bets mattered to the outcome, that their skill affected the payout.
First time I have actually watched people play these machines, I don’t visit betting shops. I walked away very sad.
These machines have their place, but it’s in a regulated casino environment, not in every betting shop in the high street.
Well written piece about the lure of the FOBT. Well he is a playwright after all, indeed the nephew of that other esteemed scribbler Robert Bolt.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/sep/23/gambling-addiction-poker-ranjit-bolt
I used to go on them way too much, now less so. Though to be honest 75% of the time if you play it sensibly you have an opportunity to take a profit…
Punters just have to learn not to go on them.
Makes me laugh on here: If you back a loser and moan you get a long almost quasi-religious lecture about pocket talk and taking full responsibility for backing a horse and having the absolute ******* cheek to expect it and its jockey to do something; then when some knob-end sticks £500 quid in a computer game designed to con people out of money he’s a poor victim of the bookie! LAUGHABLE! YOU LOT ARE
LAUGHABLE
!
LAUGHABLE! YOU LOT ARE
LAUGHABLE
!
Gambling addiction is no laughing matter Prof. whether it is FOBT’s or horse racing or any other form of gambling.
We should all think "There but for the grace of – that bloke who doesn’t exist – go I".
Value Is EverythingI used to go on them way too much, now less so. Though to be honest 75% of the time if you play it sensibly you have an opportunity to take a profit…
Umm, no you don’t have the opportunity of taking a profit 75% of the time, even when playing sensibly. If that were the case they would not be profitable for bookies.
Value Is EverythingLAUGHABLE! YOU LOT ARE
LAUGHABLE
!
Gambling addiction is no laughing matter Prof. whether it is FOBT’s or horse racing or any other form of gambling.
We should all think "There but for the grace of – that bloke who doesn’t exist – go I".
Of course it is no laughing matter but I can assure you, Ginger, that you and others on here have set out a very conservative philosophy when it comes to playing the horses: if you lose it is, barring the odd extraordinary circumstance, YOUR OWN FAULT FOR MAKING THE BET. All snot and tears that follow are self-inflicted and pocket talk.
This veiw cannot be abandoned and amended just because FOBTs are another form of gambling. It is logically and morally incoherent to do that.LAUGHABLE! YOU LOT ARE
LAUGHABLE
!
Gambling addiction is no laughing matter Prof. whether it is FOBT’s or horse racing or any other form of gambling.
We should all think "There but for the grace of – that bloke who doesn’t exist – go I".
Of course it is no laughing matter but I can assure you, Ginger, that you and others on here have set out a very conservative philosophy when it comes to playing the horses: if you lose it is, barring the odd extraordinary circumstance, YOUR OWN FAULT FOR MAKING THE BET. All snot and tears that follow are self-inflicted and pocket talk.
This veiw cannot be abandoned and amended just because FOBTs are another form of gambling. It is logically and morally incoherent to do that.They’re two different things Prof.
When I am criticising "pocket talk" I am criticising a punter who still has self control. Someone who is NOT addicted. Therefore it is his/her fault for striking the bet.
The point about FOBT’s is a lot more of the punters who use them are addicted, therefore I have a good deal of sympathy for the addicted. Just as I would if a horse racing punter was addicted.
You’re surely not saying that every punter guilty of pocket talk is an addict?
Value Is EverythingChaps,
To throw my hat in the ring I can see both points that the prof and Gingertipster make. However, in my humble opinion, what makes these machines more dangerous is the constant opportunity to get your "buzz", what about every 20 seconds at a guess. Before they came along, as a long-time punter, I`ve seen loads of addicted gamblers on the horse/greyhounds. At least then there is a time to take stock of your situation, although I know, it doesn`t enable everyone to take control.
Therefore, the quick fix nature of these machines is the disturbing element for me, and yes, I did have a period of becoming sucked in myself, but now try and pretend they don`t exist;virtually impossible with the racket they make, which is another issue.
Regards,
Llanrumneyboy
They’re two different things Prof.
When I am criticising "pocket talk" I am criticising a punter who still has self control. Someone who is NOT addicted. Therefore it is his/her fault for striking the bet.
The point about FOBT’s is a lot more of the punters who use them are addicted, therefore I have a good deal of sympathy for the addicted. Just as I would if a horse racing punter was addicted.
You’re surely not saying that every punter guilty of pocket talk is an addict?
Utter rubbish – and what’s more you know it. Gambling is gambling. You do not forfeit responsibilty for your actions by arbitrarily announcing you are an addict. Horses, cards, machines, the wheel, it’s all gambling.
If they changed the name from Fixed Odds Betting Terminals to Guaranteed Losing Terminals (which is precisely what they are) do you think that would be fair?
I think that would be fare! These terminals are a complete rip-off!
I’d like the machines to be independently investigated. Fixed Odds betting terminals that claim to be random number generators on the roulette ?
Don’t believe it for a second.
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