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Lockinge 2016

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Viewing 17 posts - 18 through 34 (of 35 total)
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  • #1245989
    RacingLife
    Participant
    • Total Posts 86

    The whole Toormore/Dutch Connection/Belardo scenario was turned on it’s head and it is hardly as if we can seriously base that on the bad ride theory from last time. Belardo was far enough back again today to negate that theory.

    I don’t think it was just down to the ride at Sandown I think the fact that they were so strung out didn’t help.. Today you could see that the leaders were coming back to the hold up horses and they bunched up about 2f out before Belardo made his move through the field. Today he didn’t have to make up too much ground – when he made his move at Sandown he was much further behind and just had too much to make up. I think Atzeni is a really good jockey.

    Conor

    #1245990
    RacingLife
    Participant
    • Total Posts 86

    In saying that I wasn’t overly confident as I said before the race I only had a small bet.. I did think he would beat Toormore but I thought there were about 5 or 6 that could win. Also Euro Charline ran a great race, she is a very good filly and the form should be solid.

    #1245996
    goreisking
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 192

    Limato easily best horse in the race, just didnt stay, but one thing is for sure…that is no group 1 race!! Maximum group 3 level

    #1245998
    mickeyjp
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1976

    Sadly only a group one in name. Hopefully Galileo gold or Air Force blue will brighten up the mile division. Need to have solow back to compare generations.

    #1246002
    goreisking
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 192

    Belardo is no group 1 horse

    #1246004
    Jonibake
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4457

    Thanks for being magnanimous Stevie. As you know me, Ginge and Nath were at Newbury today and we had a giggle predicting what you might say!! To be fair, once the ground starting drying out I began to lose the faith so it’s lucky I backed him on Wednesday as I probably wouldn’t have backed him today. We were chatting after and the general consensus was that they went a bit too quick up front and that Toormore tied up. I think I’m right in saying that the principals all came from off the pace. That said Toormore was still disappointing. I was having kittens when Euro Charlene hit the front as I have followed her off cliffs before but didn’t fancy her on sticky ground and didn’t back her on track because I lost my bleeding wallet in the car park!!! (see Joni’s Poni’s later if you want the gory details). I think it was a decent race and I think it’s also fair to say that, without Solow, the older mile division lacks a superstar. The Queen Anne is up for grabs and I think a lot will depend on conditions and tactics on the day – not a race to be putting your mortgage on. I am glad Belardo won obviously as I thought he looked back to his best at Donny and was given a bit too much to do at Sandown. Whether he wins at Group 1 level is open to debate but he probably deserves his day in the sun.

    "this perfect mix of poetry and destruction, this glory of rhythm, power and majesty: the undisputed champion of the world!!!"

    #1246014
    Avatar photoBigG
    Participant
    • Total Posts 14580

    Well done RacingLife and Jonibake, that was a cracking winner :good:

    I was pleased enough with the running of Endless Drama, he is a huge
    horse who takes a lot of training to get him right. I think he will come
    on in leaps and bounds for today’s race, I’ll be watching to see if he
    turns out for the Tattersalls Gold Cup a week tomorrow at the Curragh,
    although it might just come a bit quick for him.

    I think this is one to keep in the notebook, there’s a lot more to come
    from him.

    #1246023
    Avatar photostevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8241

    Thanks for being magnanimous Stevie. As you know me, Ginge and Nath were at Newbury today and we had a giggle predicting what you might say!! To be fair, once the ground starting drying out I began to lose the faith so it’s lucky I backed him on Wednesday as I probably wouldn’t have backed him today. We were chatting after and the general consensus was that they went a bit too quick up front and that Toormore tied up. I think I’m right in saying that the principals all came from off the pace. That said Toormore was still disappointing. I was having kittens when Euro Charlene hit the front as I have followed her off cliffs before but didn’t fancy her on sticky ground and didn’t back her on track because I lost my bleeding wallet in the car park!!! (see Joni’s Poni’s later if you want the gory details). I think it was a decent race and I think it’s also fair to say that, without Solow, the older mile division lacks a superstar. The Queen Anne is up for grabs and I think a lot will depend on conditions and tactics on the day – not a race to be putting your mortgage on. I am glad Belardo won obviously as I thought he looked back to his best at Donny and was given a bit too much to do at Sandown. Whether he wins at Group 1 level is open to debate but he probably deserves his day in the sun.

    Hope you guys had a good day out. Racing’s a tough sport to call and egg/face moments occur reasonably regularly.

    I know a few were championing Ed Dunlop’s Global Applause as already home and hosed for whichever Royal Ascot race the trainer favoured but the horse had a new one torn today by Richard Hannon’s Mehmas, who became a skinny favourite for the Coventry at 3/1 in the aftermath. The warning sign was slightly there after Gulliver went off favourite but was beaten earlier in the week.

    Global Applause went from 5/1 for the Coventry to 12/1 and must be one of the shortest lived favourites in many a year.

    Everything seemed to fall just right today for Belardo and I feel that he probably benefited from having to close on better ground today. It can be hard to make up significant margins on heavy and it may just be that he tired a bit himself late on last time.

    I would like to see Belardo do it again to put to rest his fairly long run of disappointments but today was certainly a step in the right direction.

    Limato was ridiculous odds today. Henry Candy was 1/13 the past two weeks and in May last year he was 0/32. I just wonder if people check these things and consider value before backing a horse just because there seems to be money for it. Had never won at the trip either. Crazy really.

    I had hoped Toormore would have run better than that for Nathan, Hannon was adamant he was, and always has been a true Group 1 horse. It didn’t look like that today though.

    Maybe Mehmas can be Nathan’s new one to follow. :good:

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

    #1246025
    RacingLife
    Participant
    • Total Posts 86

    Limato easily best horse in the race, just didnt stay, but one thing is for sure…that is no group 1 race!! Maximum group 3 level

    Group 3?.. I don’t know how you could say that, if that’s the case have all the Group 1s that Euro Charlene has been placed in over the last few years all been Groups 3’s as well? It might have lacked a superstar but it was a high level race.

    #1246028
    mickeyjp
    Participant
    • Total Posts 1976

    We’ve been spoiled the last few years with winners rated from 121(night of thunder) to 136 for you know who. From 2006 to 2009 the highest rated was 118. Just not a vintage year but hopefully it will be better in the coming years. Belardo is rated 117 so below average.

    #1246042
    Avatar photoyeats
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3701

    Henry Candy is unsure whether Limato stays or not, while it may have looked like he didn’t I would concur with Candy’s view.

    Frankly the owner of the horse has made a pigs ear of it by putting a new jockey on him, ironically in the name of continuity. If they had opted for continuity and put Moore up I reckon they would have known for certain whether he stayed or not and horse would have gone much closer to winning yesterday. He got 7fs well enough last season.

    It looked in France as though it took the best part of the race for Moore to get to know the horse and they would have surely have benefitted from that experience yesterday.
    He is not a straightforward ride and while of course James Willoughby’s assertion that it was a great ride by Bentley is pure fantasy and it wasn’t a bad ride, he rode him as though he hadn’t ridden him before and lacked experience.

    He wasn’t confident enough to drop Limato out far enough, he should have been behind Belardo. That’s what Moore or Spencer would have done.
    What was his feedback to Candy that the trainer still doesn’t know?

    They have now snookered themselves by a “clever dick” owner and have little alternative but to revert back to 6fs, at least in the short term.

    #1246056
    Avatar photostevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8241

    I didn’t like the way Limato was placed last season.

    Mostly it was the U turn when he was said to be swerving the Sandy Lane Stakes at Haydock but then turned up, allegedly because it was deemed that they needed to support Haydock having a “nice race”. In the end Limato went off Evens favourite and was turned over by the inconsistent Adaay from the Haggas yard.

    Jockey continuity? Limato does not know it as a concept, having been ridden by six different jockeys in a ten race career.

    Surely it must be Frankie’s turn now. Mr Dettori got off Golden Horn last year and then fluked his way back on as Buick went off to ride all weather handicappers for Godolphin. Being the gentleman Frankie is, he got off 22lbs higher rated Foundation to do reconnaissance work for Lady Bamford on Wings Of Desire in the Dante and now has the chance to win another Derby from out of the clouds.

    When a jockey is that jammy, you should stick him on your troubled horse and he’s sure to win. The other old theory is that the 7th jockey is always the one who works the magic.

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

    #1246058
    Avatar photoNathan Hughes
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34742

    Steve, Mehmas was brilliant, I was split between him and the fav but went for Mehmas as he was 7/2 and one of Hannon’s and one of the horses he beat rolled up at York and won at 33’s. The ownership had Shalaa in the race last year so if he’s half as good as that one he’ll be a good un. 3’s for the Coventry is a bit tight mind you. The Wow Signal was over double that price and he won a race by 5 furlongs on the bridle.

    Yeats, if the jockey had held the horse up last and he ran on and finished 2nd or 3rd he would have got slated for leaving too much to do. I think if you are going to see if Limato is a stayer or not then do it confidently and I thought the jockey did just that. I overheard him saying after that Limato travelled well and he was very happy with the way the race was unfolding. Then he was gone but I would imagine he went onto say the horse didn’t finish the race as well as he’d have hoped.

    Some photo’s from yesterday

    Belardo shots are on Joni’s Poni’s thread DLAP’s section

      Toormore

      Limato

      Kodi Bear

    I’ll stick a few more up later on this evening

    Gaelic Warrior Gold Cup Winner 2026

    #1246064
    LD73
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4139

    For me the jury is still out on whether Limato stayed – first race of the season and judging from how Twilight Son rang at York I think Candy’s horses in general are needing their first runs. Unless it comes up soft at Ascot I would be inclined to go for the QA (as with no Solow it will be like the Lockinge an open race there for the taking) plus if they dropped back in trip for the Diamond Jubilee you can quite easily be drawn out of the race before you have even started.

    Being a gelding the Moulin & Marois are already off the table for him so at a mile that really only leaves QA, Sussex & QE2 – running in the QA will more than likely prove whether he can stay 8f or not and if he doesn’t they can always drop back and go the July Cup, Sprint Cup, Foret route.

    For me the horse to take out of the race was Endless Drama who ran a blinder considering it was his first race back since last year’s Irish 2000g – I would worry about the bounce factor for his next race but judging by the size of him (it was mention on either RUK or C4 that his racing weighs comes in at 15kg heavier than Denman) he should be open to more improvement throughout the year.

    With regards to the winner, I always thought he was an out and out soft ground horse who won an average Dewhurst and subsequently would always find one or two too good for him in G1s unless it came up soft – for me he would be of much more interest in the French G1s where the ground is more likely to suit him.

    However, it will be interesting to see how he would fair at Ascot on better ground and unless it is proper good to firm he really should take his chance in an open year when there is no standout star now that Solow is out – Teppin is the unknown quantity for the race but you can’t vouch for how she will or will not deal with a straight undulating mile afterall Animal Kingdom was a better horse and he wasn’t sighted in the race a few years back.

    As previously said the mile division is very open and it could be that an above average member of the classic generation could trump them all when they eventually clash at Goodwood.

    #1246099
    Avatar photoyeats
    Participant
    • Total Posts 3701

    Yeats, if the jockey had held the horse up last and he ran on and finished 2nd or 3rd he would have got slated for leaving too much to do. I think if you are going to see if Limato is a stayer or not then do it confidently and I thought the jockey did just that. I overheard him saying after that Limato travelled well and he was very happy with the way the race was unfolding. Then he was gone but I would imagine he went onto say the horse didn’t finish the race as well as he’d have hoped.

    Nathan, the jockey rode and spoke as you would expect from someone who hadn’t ridden the horse before and lacked experience, he told you nothing you didn’t know watching the race.
    He didn’t ride the horse confidently and drop him out last because he was fearful of what you describe, finishing 2nd or 3rd and being slated for giving him too much to do, although it would have been a place or two ahead of what was actually achieved lol.

    Your argument would have some merit if it was Limato’s normal modus operandi but he’s run all his best races from the back and he was free enough last Saturday.
    As I said Harry Bentley was an odd choice given they wanted continuity and Candy still doesn’t know whether he stays. They would have known if Moore had ridden him again.

    If Moore isn’t available Jamie Spencer looks made to measure for the horse, horse and jockey would be in complete unison.

    As it is, it looks long odds on they will run in the Diamond Jubilee with Bentley aboard and see what happens there.

    Good pics by the way :good:

    #1246116
    Avatar photoNathan Hughes
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34742

    I’m not sure on the jockeys arrangements, in an ideal world you would want Moore on board yes.
    I can see what you are saying but I would imagine the jockey was following instructions, it’s a group 1 so I cant envisage Candy saying ‘ride how you see fit’ They must have had some plan? a bit naïve if they didn’t in such a race. Maybe Candy wanted him to follow or stay within so many lengths of one of the principles.

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    #1246124
    Avatar photoNathan Hughes
    Participant
    • Total Posts 34742

    Dutch Connection

    Euro Charlene

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