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Apart from the horses that obviously show a dislike for not putting it all in at the end of races, I just go on the assumption that all horses have good minds and are willing to run through a wall or as the cycling reference goes ‘go into the red’ particularly as there are multiple times where sadly horses have literally dropped dead shortly after finishing a race.
I think befair can’t get over his Irish Nationalism.
For some, anything a British person says about any Irishman is taken the worst possible way.Value Is EverythingThat comment betrays more about you than me Ginger; btw I have triple nationalism, thanks to the Good Friday Agreement (Irish, British, and European).
Ballydoyle and this thread will be around for a while
They may not dominate as such but I’d think they will still be taking more than their fair share of big race triumphsBlackbeard to conquer the World
Absolutely love the Irish, befair; a wonderful nation of horse lovers.
Only one or two who could do with letting go of their past (then possibly well founded) prejudices / distrust against the British.
As Ian says, how anyone could think this thread is about envy is absurd…
Unless that is, someone somehow believes it is a whole bunch of British TRFers getting at a successful Irishman purely because he is a successful Irishman. How likely is that?
Value Is Everything“I think befair can’t get over his Irish Nationalism.
For some, anything a British person says about any Irishman is taken the worst possible way.” – GingertipsterAdmin,
The above noted comment by Gingertipster on this thread is a clear example of blatant racism and bigotry, and should not be tolerated on this Forum (or anywhere else). What is your Policy towards racism? Please advise so the participants can behave accordingly…
IanDavies,
Where are you now with your eye-pleasing “challenge to anything” belief?
“If there is one undercurrent I detect…it is blind deference and a complete refusal to challenge anything”
To the ones that read the referenced comment without saying anything, shame on you!
Where am I now?
What an odd question.
I guess I am where I have always been – in a position to be an independent freethinker and to offer my views without worrying, legality aside, about the consequences, rather than blindly deferential.
Tribalism is one of the most inane things in life, never mind in racing, and it gets in the way of constructive critical debate.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"Oh Turkoman,
We had a wonderful debate / difference of opinion in the “Specialise” thread, please forget it and move on.As I said in my subsequent post:
Only one or two (Irishmen) who could do with letting go of their past (then possibly well founded) prejudices / distrust against the British.
There are also one or two (actually probably a lot more) Protestant Northern Irish (or even Protestant mainland British) who could do with letting go of their past (then possibly well founded) prejudices / distrust against the Catholic Irish.
I don’t think that is at all controversial, mate.
Value Is EverythingTotally saddened that this topic has veered way off the opening thread and one or two folk straying into areas nothing to do with a racing forum. Fwiw there is definite envy of coolmore by many people and you hear many saying its boring when they win so many prizes. Never understand that attitude. If there horse is the best on the day so be it. Its up to others to compete with them in afraid. They will continue to win big races as they are the most astute in buying the right horses and while the competition will be tougher minus galileo they have shown with smb and snowfall how powerful his broodmares can be.
Let’s just enjoy the wonderful sport of racing and keep the other stuff for a different forum.“Fwiw there is definite envy of coolmore by many people and you hear many saying its boring when they win so many prizes”.
Can you or anyone else tell us where this “definite envy of Coolmore” is on this thread, Mickeyip?
Fwiw. I can understand anyone thinking one trainer/team winning most of the top races being “boring”. Whether that’s an Irish or British trainer, doesn’t matter.
Personally think it’s great when someone not used to winning wins a big race… because otherwise it begins to get a bit boring. Seem to remember commentators mentioning the same when Balding won the Guineas… And then the next year even heard it from some Irish commentators when Bolger won.
Going back a bit: I was a great fan of Danoli and Limestone Lad for similar reasons, urging them on even when racing against big British trainers!
The stuff you think is “envy” really isn’t. It’s just people wanting more trainers to win big prizes; which is only natural. We love the underdog.
Value Is EverythingI’m not envious of coolmore. They seem to be a bit of a joyless bunch frankly.8
I wouldn’t be envious of having all that success and still having a face like a bulldog licking piss off a nettle.
It is boring. Coolmore is a business and it’s all about upping a horse’s stallion fee or sale value. This means they enter several horses (often more than half the field) in (mainly) middle distance Group 1 races, particularly in Ireland where opposition is often weaker, due in part to the dominance of Galileo (which may, of course be less of an advantage in future). And the best horse doesn’t always win for whatever reason (team tactics, the general unpredictability of the scatter-gun approach…). It’s not a criticism; it works for them. It is boring though and has resulted in several decidedly mediocre Derby winners. If almost the entire field is in the same ownership (or split between 2 major owners), it immediately reduces interest. Doesn’t matter if it’s Coolmore, Godolphin, Juddmonte, Cheveley Park, JP McManus or Gigginstown. Many of us instinctively cheer on the smaller owners, unless there’s a real superstar, in which case most true racing fans would want to see that one win. Coolmore haven’t had one of those for a while though. A fabulous overall record and a lot of good, or very good horses but it does look like the star is waning a bit. Maybe Snowfall can turn the tide.
It’s not racist to call out nationalism. Indeed, if more people had done so during the past few years, we might not be in the mess we’re in now. Nationalism isn’t the same as race, or, indeed, patriotism. That said, I don’t really see any evidence that this tag applies to Befair’s post. The “envy” accusation is preposterous though. Personally, I’m envious of literally anyone who owns a decent racehorse (or any racehorse come to that). So what? I can still voice an opinion based on what I consider to be the the facts.
What’s this “envy” rubbish all about, anyway?
I’m a punter, I don’t even own a horse – don’t want to, either – why would I be envious of an operation I simply find repetitive in their hype and boring?
People who assume others suffer from envy often have the affliction themselves and wrongly assume it’s a universal human condition.
One thing’s for sure – Coolmore wouldn’t cross the road to do the proverbial on those who defend them even if they were on fire.
They don’t care about their critics and they don’t care about their apologists either.
It’s an internet racing forum – free speech rules.
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It's the "Millwall FC" of Point broadcasts: "No One Likes Us - We Don't Care"We all love it when the underdog wins. Its in our dna but we can grow to tire of constant winners. When someone is dominant in a sport like say Michael Schumacher then folk look forward to the time they aren’t winning. Coolmores record in the classics recently has been amazing and while it doesn’t irk folk on here there are many griping about it elsewhere. Money talks now more than ever so underdog stories are less and less prevalent but we should still be able to admire those at the top of their game. With galileo now sadly passed will it dimish coolmore. Unlikely IMHO as they still seem to be able to buy cracking horses. Tenebrism looks an outstanding prospect as its breeding suggested as does Luxembourg.
I’m sure there will be more big races spread around and I for one miss the top class French horses like zafonic coming over. There may be a big breakthrough by one of the unheralded trainers here or in Ireland. It’s what makes the sport so fascinating.BTW coolmore are a business and behave as such but that’s not to say they don’t care what others say. John Magnier got fed up with negative interviewing so stop doing them. I’ve said before coolmore should have a spokesperson like Angus gold does and I’m sure it would help aiden concentrate on the horses and be more helpful to the public. Anybody who has had a tour of coolmore has said they are hugely welcoming and a brilliant day. There will always be critics whatever folk do so much more now due to social media. It doesn’t make the critics view more valid than the so called apologists which is a very unnecessary term BTW.
“There are also one or two (actually probably a lot more) Protestant Northern Irish (or even Protestant mainland British) who could do with letting go of their past (then possibly well founded) prejudices / distrust against the Catholic Irish.”
Why drag religion into the argument Ginger? We atheists are tired of it
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