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Its a whole different ball game up there EW, your going against hype, pure and simple imo.<br>Mid range types usually run on merit, although the odd bit of an attempt to hoodwink the handicapper occurs.<br>The low grade stuff needs to be looked at differently again as its made up of plans, plots, whatever you want to call them. I enjoy all three. Though have found out through my wallet over the years that the low grade stuff takes the same if not more patience, despite many more races.
Prufrock, I wasnt directing anything at anybody. As you know, I compile my own SF’s. How many times do you use your ratings and say to yourself, what are they playing at, and then again you find yourself saying somthing along the lines of , "they’ve done it again, imo this horse needs a drop in trip or a stiffer course, or different going, or needs to come from behind off a strong pace not trailblaze". Isnt it nice after the wait to feel confident that everythings in place and they’re going for it, and get a nice price early before the gamble takes place if there is one, I know I like it, it makes all the work and patience / discipline seem worthwhile. I dont know if you can call this cheating. Perhaps you’ve worked out what the horse needs before the trainer, due to his/her other daily commitments and we have all day to study form. I dont know for sure, but I suspect they are aware of the situation.:o
What I’m trying to say is I’m happy the way things are. For me, I’d be going against hype in top class stuff.<br>Expecting form to work out quite well in class C+, maybe class D if the prize money is half decent.<br>Trying to work out if they’re going for it today in the low grade stuff.
So no, I dont understand why everyone wants the sport to be a prescise science. For the same reasons I dont understand why you want sectional times to be available off the shelf Prufrock, you compile your own which must take a bit of time and no doubt you cash in from time to time, by having knowledge unavailable to the public. Yet you seem to really want sectionals to be readily available for all couses. Believe me, the snotty nosed kid will work out how to utilise them in a very short space of time. I’d be making hay while the sun shines, not out doing a rain dance :biggrin:
I’m not trying to be argumentative Prufrock. I’m sure if we were sat in a pub chatting you’d see my expressions and mannerisms and not take offence at all;) Then again, maybe you’d glass me:biggrin:
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Quote: from CPGagie on 4:23 am on Mar. 2, 2005[br]Its a whole different ball game up there EW, your going against hype, pure and simple imo.<br>
<br>Personally,i believe the formbook:biggrin: be it the Arc or a Bandit race at Southwell
<br>Ian
I’ve never met Prufrock either,but at those odd’s,every man has his price :biggrin:
(Edited by empty wallet at 5:30 am on Mar. 2, 2005)<br>
(Edited by empty wallet at 8:50 am on Mar. 2, 2005)
If backandlay wants to put up a market I might be tempted to avail myself of a bit of that 1,000,000/1 "glassing" in the belief that insider trading would be allowed by CPGagie in line with some of the comments expressed on this thread. :biggrin:
It’s a fair point about the sectional timing. I have got to the stage where I’m spending a lot of time gathering the bloody things and very little time in putting them to much use. The only way I can see of moving forward is to push for their wider acceptance, which would also, in my opinion, enhance racing as a product. And, rightly or wrongly, I fancy my chances of seeing off the snotty-nosed kids, many of whom seem to struggle with one-dimensional time analysis as it is.
(Edited by Prufrock at 10:30 am on Mar. 2, 2005)
IAN said:
I’ve never met Prufrock, but I’d price up the odds on him….. ”glassing” anyone at about…..a million to one.
Some might suggest the two (your not having met me and me not having "glassed" anyone) are a related contingency. But not me, oh no not me.:cool:  <br>
(Edited by Prufrock at 11:04 am on Mar. 2, 2005)
Quote: from ULTIMATE NIGHTMARE on 10:42 am on Mar. 2, 2005[br]  When i watch the racing @ Nad Al Sheba it is a spectacle, strange though some results are, it shows how competetive racing can be without obvious cheating. i may be wrong but it is the perception i get. <br>
<br>Maybe because the prize money is better than here,or maybe there is no  betting market to exploit
or could it be both-who know’s
(Edited by empty wallet at 11:58 am on Mar. 2, 2005)
Maybe,us mugs should stop betting on SUBSTANDARD racing,convert to sport’s betting and see how much the £8 billion bet on horse racing last year reduces the prize money available for the whole of racing
What happen’s to a business when it’s customer’s aren’t satisfied with the product or service they are paying for ?
I’ll just point this out before Ian Davies does, but we need more racing in order to provide the betting turnover to produce the funds to keep the whole show on the road. More racing means primarily cheap racing, for obvious reasons. But cheap racing is regarded as so dubious by so many that it is arguably not fulfilling its function.
I would describe this as a vicious circle, except for the fact that the circle can be broken. Cheap racing need not be such a no-go area. What is required above all else is for the existing authorities to be more on-the-ball with regards to the framing of races and the rooting-out of corrupt practices. ÂÂÂ
Chief,
When bandit filth started out 14 months ago you said much the same thing. I would have hoped that subsequent events proving you horribly wrong may have prevented you repeating your wrongheaded argument.
To reiterate the main developments since the advent of bandit racing:
– racing on the front pages for all the wrong reason in only the second month of regional racing. A dreadful advertisement for the sport which has assured that fresh blood has been thin on the ground.
– the trickle away from impenetrable racing by the addicts it was supposed to serve has become a flood,  with FOBT turnover now estimated to be in the tens of billions in the last twelve months.
– the more sophisticated punter has turned their back on UK racing and fresh blood is thin on the ground. Uniquely in a fast growing industry, where turnover on all other sports is growing rapidly, UK racing business has stagnated on the exchanges in the last six months.
Less is More.
Whatever this filth is bringing in it is costing the sport many times over in terms of its long term image and attractiveness to the general public.
(Edited by Glenn at 2:53 pm on Mar. 2, 2005)
Quote: from Glenn on 2:45 pm on Mar. 2, 2005[br]
– racing on the front pages for all the wrong reason in only the second month of regional racing.
I’m probably wasting my time, but whilst it’s strictly accurate to state that the race in question (I’m assuming you refer to Ballinger Ridge and Fallon) was run at a regional meeting, it was in fact an auction maiden that could have been run at any low level AW or turf flat meeting during the year.
Ballinger Ridge was rated 60 before that race, way too high to run in a banded race, and the eventual winner, Rye, was given a mark of 70 for her win.
AP<br>
AP – The ratings of the horses are neither here nor there as regards integrity, it’s the prize money that counts. This was less than £1500 for the Ballinger Ridge race, so such a race wouldn’t have been staged at a normal meeting in 2004 as you suggest.
Chief – I’ve got plenty in common with the average betting shop punter – we both want decipharable racing. We may choose to decipher it in different ways but we both want the results to be predictable from the publicly available information. You take a very patronising attitude to these customers believing they will bet on any rubbish that’s served up to them. I think you are being proved wrong as more and more drift to FOBTs – who do the random betting thing much better, and to lower margins, than bandit filth ever will.
Do you ”like” the idea of someone ”glassing me” then, Barry?
To be fair, Ian, that is only one possible inference from my remarks. I could have been trying to imply that an association with you might, for whatever reason, have led me to glass someone else. Barry, for instance.:cool:
Sometimes ambiguities are there for a very good reason.
betting shop turning over £20K per week over counter
U.K. horse-racing singles prior to each race 40% i.e. £8K
profit on this £8K = 7% £560 per week.
remaining 60%, multiples,sports , lucky 15’s. lucky numbers and all other dross, i.e. £12K
profit on this £12K = 25% £3K per week.
is horse-racing and subsequently the levy fighting a losing battle
Agreed – if only I could remember what I had written (now apparently deleted).
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