August 5, 2006 at 17:22 #74656ArtemisParticipant
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I posted this on another thread the other day, discussing the Goodwood times.
‘The other pair of races featured a very good performance from the 2yo Cumin, who was only 0.29secs(5lbs) slower than the 3yo Dream Theme. <br>Adjusting for weight carried and WFA, Cumin is 23lbs better than the Class 2 handicap winner on this showing. Cumin won by 7 lengths and will be interesting next time if not aimed too high.’
I didn’t try to put a speed figure to this performance, but I see Topspeed has only rated Dream Theme on 65 and Cumin on 89. Maybe the race wasn’t as good as I thought.August 5, 2006 at 17:58 #74657
Dont patronise EC
When looking for a 1000 guineas (or maybe more likely Oaks) winner for next year, would want to see better form than this.
Seems like the bookies agree too…Nowhere to be seen in the bettingAugust 5, 2006 at 18:02 #74658
David Bedford had head issues..he couldn’t compete against runners..just the clock…I’m sure there are horses with similar foibles. Seb Coe broke loads of records though and could compete tactically…the difference between the two runners doesn’t question the ability to run fast..it highlights other issues.
<br>Pinching my lines now too… ;)August 5, 2006 at 18:07 #74659davidjohnsonMember
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Quote: from clivex on 6:58 pm on Aug. 5, 2006[br]When looking for a 1000 guineas (or maybe more likely Oaks) winner for next year, would want to see better form than this.
Would be very surprised if there is a filly that has already run, that goes on to contest the Oaks, that has better form than Cumin.
Can’t see her being a Guineas filly, her dam is an unraced daughter of User Friendly.August 5, 2006 at 18:19 #74660
No, you confirmed my Seb Coe point :)
Possibly true for the oaks.August 5, 2006 at 18:52 #74661davidjohnsonMember
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Come on lads, let’s prevent this thread from going the way a few have.August 5, 2006 at 23:35 #74662AnonymousInactive
- Total Posts 17718
Quote: from EC on 7:59 pm on Aug. 5, 2006[br]yes it’s a repetetive theme on here..same folk hounding the same folk.
must be very boring for other people reading comments on a thread that seem to question why folk would post when they have no interest in the thread except for criticising the same thing they do on every thread where a certain subject crops up…i think we know that Clive and RH don’t like speed figures by now..;)
I really don’t know why I bother, but I have spent a couple of hours going through old books to enlarge on my earlier post. <br> Lose the persecution complex, and you might get somewhere. The old pathos and ‘victim’ culture is getting a little wearing.
<br>from: The Winning Horseplayer, by Andrew Beyer.<br>"An animal may run a quarter of a mile in 22 seconds, opening a clear lead over his opposition, reach the half mile in 45 flat, and go on to win with ease.But if the same horse engages in a head-to-head duel in 22 and 45, he may collapse.<br>There are many cases too, in which horses will vie for the lead in fractions that don’t appear fast, but one of them will seem to crack under pressure, anyway. The explanation may be that somewhere during the course of that duel, one of the speedballs accelerates and runs a sixteenth of a mile in 5.6 seconds, delivering a swift (but barely perceptible) knockout punch.<br> Although I remain intrigued by the possibility of analyzing fractional times mathematically, the best way to judge the effects of pace is the way trip handicappers do: to watch races intelligently and perceptively.
As Chompy indicated, Cumin has proved little so far, and, as I pointed out, the quality of the opposition does make a difference. Whether one accepts either is entirely down to their own disposition!August 6, 2006 at 00:31 #74663FlatSeasonLoverParticipant
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I stick by my view but wish I never said anything.August 6, 2006 at 09:57 #74664
thread lhas turned into playschool againAugust 6, 2006 at 10:01 #74665
Good to see you’re still as desperate as ever to undermine everything EC or I say.
<br>August 6, 2006 at 10:40 #74666
Understand what yer saying Stav, but EC does tend to bite a little ,however, EC has posted two excellent replies imhaho to those antagonists in posts 10.55 Aug 04 and 10.45 Au 05.
If those people can put up valid argument against his posts then do so, if not, i think they’re wastig their time posting and are best ignored
reet brings in an interesting point quoting Beyer, however, Beyer is talking about Pace handicapping and not Speedfigure compiling, a different way to handicap races alltogether
(Edited by empty wallet at 11:41 am on Aug. 6, 2006)August 6, 2006 at 11:07 #74667FlatSeasonLoverParticipant
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Stav I thought I did put up a reasoned argument why I disagreed with EC?
1200 posts isn’t a bad contribution either is it?August 6, 2006 at 11:14 #74668
I see nothing wrong with your comment tbh, however i would say it’s SAnder who has it to prove ;)August 6, 2006 at 11:19 #74669
Sanders group 2 and group 3 wins agaisnt the best available count for nothing against a maidenAugust 6, 2006 at 11:24 #74670
Becuase you want to score points you misunderstand my post
Sander is indeed a good horse however she has to prove it (to me at least) that she is better than Strategic Prince, who is the best 2yo imo at this time.
Cumin has put in the best time against the clock, but that ability has to be proven against better horses like Sander and Strategic
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