September 12, 2019 at 18:17 #1453772GingertipsterParticipant
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Some on here still don’t appear to understand how ratings are achieved/worked out.
Please remember females get a 3 lb sex allowance.
ie On the track – females carry 3 lbs less than males.
Therefore, in order to put up a rating better than the male, a female needs to beat the male by a distance worth greater than that 3 lbs. Or – if winning with more in hand than winning distance suggests – winning with more in hand than the 3 lb allowance.
ie It is very possible a female racehorse beats the male in a race and yet the male is rated higher in the ratings because of weight carried.value is everythingSeptember 12, 2019 at 19:40 #1453782tbracingParticipant
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Whilst I won’t argue about his rating, or the functionality and purpose of ratings, it doesn’t paint a whole picture. Timeform are of course excellent judges and their ratings hold water and are credible. But one of the best horses I have seen in my time following racing is Zarkava, her Arc is not particularly well rated given she only beat home Youmzain but for me given the ability she showed through he career and how comfortably she won the Arc she is one of the best winners I have seen of that race. She just about won every race of her career with something in hand and was barely into top gear most of her wins, including an easy win against Goldikova over a mile in a year she comfortably won over 10f and 12f. She was a super star but won’t be remembered as a great winner of the race if based purely on ratings.September 13, 2019 at 19:43 #1453861GingertipsterParticipant
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Zarkava was Timeform rated 133, tb. Both Treve and Enable have been rated 1 lb better on 134 since. Neither managed to reproduce it in their second Arcs, but most top horses do improve at least a little at four… Believe am right in saying; at the time of her Arc victory Zarkava’s was the best Timeform rating put up by any three year old filly in the race – I believe same as Three Troikas in 1979. Allez France‘s 136 was as a four year old (rated 132 at three). Very unfortunate Zarkava (who’d improved with racing throughout her 3 year old campaign) did not race on at four. Had she done so could well have eclipsed Allez France.
However, in order to get a full picture of all performances – both female and male – it is surely best to add the 3 lb allowance to female winners – as they’d get that 3 lbs when racing against males. So Zarkava’s 133 should be seen as equivelent to a colt putting up 136. You’ve got to go back to 2001 and Sakhee‘s 6 lengths victory in order to find a male with as good a rating for winning the Arc. And back to 1999 and Montjeu to find one to beat it with 137.
On Timeform ratings Zarkava’s Arc IS rated amongst the very best.value is everythingSeptember 14, 2019 at 19:51 #1454944tbracingParticipant
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I can’t disagree with your statement Ginge, certainly about the allowance. And you are right she could have gone on to improve as a 4yo but unfortunately we didn’t get to find out. I guess all I am saying is, whilst I agree ratings are important and hold water, things have to be put in perspective also and what amazed me about Zarkava looking back is how easy she won at 8f, beating Goldikova, who has gone down as a great, then also at 10f and then twice at 12f all at the very top level and impressively every time. For me her ratings don’t paint the whole picture, but then of course ratings are there as a guide not as an absolute. I agree with you it was a shame she didn’t race on at 4.
Out of interest what did you make of Logician today? Have Timeform put up a rating yet? I’d be interested to see how they have rated him, see that RPR’s have already gone up and rated him 119.
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