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I’m in the camp that thinks AP on Denman is a mistake for most of the reasons others have suggested.
BUT
I’m seeing a fairytale in the making. ‘Not as good as he used to be, his time has passed, can’t match the big boys anymore.’ Could be applied to either horse or rider & both could well spring a surprise on us naynsayers.
Add my name to the naysayers. Thomas has done nothing wrong on the horse and has been a significant part of Denman’s development. What happened to loyalty in sport?
I cannot understand where all this hatred on this forum towards AP comes from, he is an absolutely brilliant jockey, and a fantastic jockey booking for all concerned with Denman.
A fine jockey, and a great booking for those who are in the Denman camp (including myself).
Where does ‘hatred’ come in to it? One or two people appear to be living in a time warp where AP is concerned.
Where does ‘hatred’ come in to it? One or two people appear to be living in a time warp where AP is concerned.
The way some people talk about him on this forum, you wouldn’t think that he has been Champion jockey for the number of years that he has been. Suppose it’s the old English mentality of trying to de-throne those who appear to excel at their profession.
I love how Sam Thomas was offered the consolation prize of riding Tricky Trickster by Nicholls. I bet he felt like he’d just won the lottery.
It’s not ‘tall poppy syndrome’ and it’s not hatred towards AP……it’s just that he seems much more of a backable proposition in a three grand claimer than he is in a big money Saturday TV or Graded race. Maybe someone has some level stakes stats to bear this out ? He’s a 7lb negative for me in good races, and has been for a couple of years.
Suppose it’s the old English mentality of trying to de-throne those who appear to excel at their profession.
I know Gaz!
I know he’s 14 times champion but recently i regard McCoy being on a horse i fancy as a negative.
I’m not saying the following would have won but again i backed 2 of his that were favs and disappointed – Killyglen and Song of Songs.
Killyglen a lovely jumper started making mistakes and was pulled up and Song of Songs who was given too much to do. It’s not sour grapes cos i had 3 good winners on the day.
You only have to watch others like Geraghty, Lee ,Maguire etc. to see the difference. There are so many good young jocks around too – look at Griffiths and Skelton today.
Extract from Sporting Life website:
Barber feels the recruitment of McCoy will bolster the chances of Denman wresting away the Gold Cup from Kauto Star, who last year became the first horse in history to regain the Cheltenham showpiece.
He said: "We know that to be taking on Ruby on Kauto Star, we need to have a jockey who is at least his equal.
"We wouldn’t want a situation where we were
theoretically giving away several pounds
.
"You can’t do that if you want to win a Gold Cup."
I am not surprised Thomas has not got the call but to make such a comment is utterly unforgiveable in my book. Lest we forget Thomas won them a gold cup in the past but now he is being publicly humiliated. Barber/Findlay/Barber are making themselves look like a right bunch of muppets.
Agree with the above comment. Now that McCoy is on Denman has completely knocked all confidence in him tbh.
I can Ruby Walsh riding him to sleep. Poor Sam Thomas….rode the perfect race in 08 and dumped because Paul Nicholls can’t accept defeat
I criticised Sam Thomas for his ride on Kauto Star in the 2008 Betfair Chase, but he would be in the saddle at both Newbury and Cheltenham if I owned ‘The Tank’. He clearly has a good relationship with Denman – the kind of relationship that can’t be built in just four weeks.
Some may chuckle at what I’m about to write, but Kauto has been beating up on McCoy for the past five years. Whether it be Exotic Dancer, Albertas Run or L’ami, Kauto has either laughed at him or snatched victory from the jaws of defeat.
You may laugh, but Kauto has a pyschological edge over McCoy. AP must have nightmares about the horse!
McCoy has ridden the likes of Make A Stand, Edredon Bleu and Mr Mulligan to big race victories at The Festival. These horses were always ridden aggressively and Denman should not be inconvenienced by McCoy’s presence in the saddle. They are, theoretically, an ideal combination, but one can’t help but feel that Denman is a slightly different proposotion.
I would choose McCoy over any other jockey 90% of the time, but he would be third on my list behind Ruby Walsh and Barry Geraghty when choosing a big race pilot.
You simply can’t knock a man who has ridden over 3,000 winners and McCoy’s determination and will to win are a real inspiration. He conducts himself in an exemplary fashion and is a true role model to all aspiring young riders.
It will be very interesting if Denman gets beat next Saturday. Highly unlikely, but stranger things have happened.
I know McCoy is a great jockey but this season I’ve never known him ride so badly, so a part of me is pleased that he’s going to ride Denman as he will either give the horse another bad ride or that he always does badly at the Festival anyway.
- Total Posts 17716
Extract from Sporting Life website:
Barber feels the recruitment of McCoy will bolster the chances of Denman wresting away the Gold Cup from Kauto Star, who last year became the first horse in history to regain the Cheltenham showpiece.
He said: "We know that to be taking on Ruby on Kauto Star, we need to have a jockey who is at least his equal.
"We wouldn’t want a situation where we were
theoretically giving away several pounds
.
"You can’t do that if you want to win a Gold Cup."
I am not surprised Thomas has not got the call but to make such a comment is utterly unforgiveable in my book. Lest we forget Thomas won them a gold cup in the past but now he is being publicly humiliated. Barber/Findlay/Barber are making themselves look like a right bunch of muppets.
I’d say right now they are about as popular as a fart in a spacesuit.
The one thing they can’t do is take away the fact Sam did it! He won a Gold Cup and proved he was the right man for the job. However in racing that’s yesterdays news and Sam will survived he’s not the first or the last this has happened to.
As far as AP goes he does have an uncanny knack of knowing exactly when it’s time to party. My earliest memory of AP was at Uttoxeter when he was riding a 2nd favourite and I had backed it. I was standing with my trainer and turned to him and said what he doing he’s gone way too soon…..not a bit of it he had been lying in 2nd but in a flash sprinted into a 5 length lead and the horse just kept going and going for him and he won by 30 lengths or some crazy distance like that.
I saw AP win dozens and dozens of races doing exactly the same thing and leaving top jockeys scratching their heads wondering what had just happened.
I was really touting for Sam to get this ride but face facts Sam isn’t AP and they did allow him to ride him at Newbury just prior to the Gold Cup over Ruby saying the wanted Sam because he would be riding him in the Gold Cup.
I find it hard to defend them but realistically what choice do they have?
The know they are up against it and Kauto is not going to be the same Kauto they met in 2008. To beat him they need
the best judge of pace money can buy and hopefully take the sting out of Kauto tail. I think about the best they can hope for is that they both hit the hill exhausted and then AP will be worth every bit of this 7lbs he speaks of.Of course if he wins in the same manner as Sam did then it will be Sam should have rode him.
But mark my words if AP wins the very first guy who will shake his hand is Sam Thomas if he can get in there before Ruby.
Just imagine yourself out for a drink with the lads and your horse had just been beaten a short head in the Gold Cup and one of you mates says. "Told you, you should have had AP on board"…………Bummer or what?
.
"I think about the best they can hope for is that they both hit the hill exhausted and then AP will be worth every bit of this 7lbs he speaks of."
That is a worrying worst case scenario, Fist.
Colin
Lest we forget Thomas won them a gold cup in the past but now he is being publicly humiliated. Barber/Findlay/Barber are making themselves look like a right bunch of muppets.
Let’s be clear. Sam Thomas did
not
"win them" the Gold Cup – the horse did it all by himself. Bella Emberg could have ridden Denman in March 2008, and he still would have won.
I would have at least twenty other jockeys on my horse, before I reached for Sam Thomas. Decent yokes get him out of trouble, imo, and he can’t get moderate ones jumping for him.
AP is light-years better, and the decision makes perfect sense. Denman needs a positive ride if he is to have any chance of turning Kauto Star over, and McCoy is exactly the man for the job.
As for loyalty, when has this ever existed in racing (beyond JP’s apparent refusal to jotter Frank Berry – a man who couldn’t pick his nose, let alone a decent horse).
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