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As a betting shop punter concentrating totally on placepots I am intrigued to know if others share my frustration regarding non-runners. I leave my selsections as late as possible to get as many non-runners as possible,the reason being that I do not wish to be on a favourite….it ruins the placepot pool.Invariably it annoys me when I get home to find that during the 30-40 minutes since I left the betting shop there seems to have been several non-runners added to the list,and this happens on a regular basis. Now we all know that some non-runners cannot be forecast in advance such as those who will not go into stalls or get injured before the start but I have a sneaking suspicion that there is a delay between the scratching of horses and that info reaching the public, or indeed the betting shops.My questions are 1)how long is this delay and is it avoidable ? 2) if this delay is commonplace could something be done to better inform the betting public when pool bets depend on selections being made before the first race of the day ? As a parting shot ….does anyone realise that a delay in relaying such important information could easily present opportunities to manipulate a pool ? By this I refer to the knowledge that the absence of a fancied runner known to a few rather than the majority can mean that the under performance of the eventual favourite can wipe out a very large percentage of the pool when the number of selections riding on the said jolly has been doubled or trebled by the absence of other fancied runners. The pool is also affected by the reduction in the number of runners to 15 from 16,7 from 8,or 4 from 5. I like to think I employ a certain amount of skill and judgement to my betting but tardiness in relaying information to the punter makes the game a travesty. Perhaps Racing for change needs to put this matter on the agenda because when punters drift away racing will die.
Following link has the NR’s and the times they are withdrawn so you can check out whether you feel any are delayed or not.
John,
Perhaps it would be better to campaign for changes to the way the Placepot operates, so that it’s a more level playing field for all punters.
There’s no reason why the Tote shouldn’t ignore non runners after a certain point, say 09:00 on the day of the race. So if a race is reduced from 8 to 7 because a horse won’t go in the stalls, or a horse is withdrawn half an hour before the race because the going has changed, the Placepot would still be settled on the first three places.
It makes no difference at all to the Tote as their percentage is guaranteed. It would result in smaller dividends, but that would be balanced by more winning punters.
It would also be very easy for the Tote to modify their betting slips and their software so that the punter would have the option of nominating an alternative selection in the event of a non runner. Ok, that wouldn’t help if your bet had multiple non runners, but it would give you the chance to avoid being put automatically on the favourite.
A competent organisation with any sort of understanding of how their customers think would have made this type of change years ago – sadly we’re stuck with the people that run our Tote, people who think the Scoop6 is the greatest thing since Haddock and Chips.
AP
However did she do it for £2?
- Total Posts 17716
Following link has the NR’s and the times they are withdrawn so you can check out whether you feel any are delayed or not.
On a side note, can anyone explain why Hexham had 2 self-certs for
going
?
The thing is, I don’t think the Placepot is really designed for off course betting, it’s almost perfect for their on course booths because you’ve got plenty of time to see if there are any non runners. And on course there are plenty of distractions so you don’t really care that the dividend could be anything between a pound & a thousand.
This is the big issue with the Tote for me: it’s totally pointless making your selections early then betting with the Tote, the price could be equivalent to 10/1 when you put the bet on, but with no option to ‘take a price’ any sort of a gamble & your money can go down the dumper by the off.
Credit to the Tote for more US style ‘exotic’ bets but you must be kidding if you think they could handle a monopoly.
Thank you to Richard Hoiles and whilst I shall use the suggested website to monitor non-runners on the actual day I am not absolutely sure that it will answer my question regarding the time elapsed between the declaration of a non-runner and it reaching the betting shop. Do you Richard or anyone else know if anyone in the BHA,Weatherby’s,the Jockey Club, the Racing Post or anyone at all who could provide a more exact answer which explains the process step by step. I also agree with the other comments regarding the Tote but with regard to the placepot I have often wondered whether a substitute selection would be viable but I suspect not considering the scant respect the Tote has for its customers. On a slightly different tack I would scrap the Scoop6 and replace it with a Super Placepot of 8 legs
over 2 meetings (or even 3 meetings) allowing the same minimum stakes of 5p for permutations with the dividend declared to a £1. The interest from punters would be vast and the dividends exciting.On a slightly different tack I would scrap the Scoop6 and replace it with a Super Placepot of 8 legs
over 2 meetings (or even 3 meetings) allowing the same minimum stakes of 5p for permutations with the dividend declared to a £1. The interest from punters would be vast and the dividends exciting.If you want a Super Placepot over two meetings, you could always do two quadpots.
I don’t think the Scoop 6 should be scrapped, I’d consider anyone betting vast amounts on it to be foolish (far better value available elsewhere) & it’s just the (alternative to a Lotto) ticket when it comes to the casual punter.
Because when you say ‘the interest from punters would be vast’ you mean only punters that really understand perms.
I would just like to add, that while I disagree with you, it’s refreshing to see a forum-ite criticise the Tote; some on here consider the Tote to be the future, others I’d venture to say think the sun shines out of it’s (expletive)
Oldjohn,
As it puts the time of coming out on the BHA website if any are on there when you leave home but not NR’s in shops when you get there you will have your answer.
If it is that crucial to you why not just place online just before first race after checking the aforementioned website.
I also agree with Alan that once racing starts any non runners announced during afternoon should not reduce the overall number of places for placepot purposes. Shouldn’t be able to move the goalposts once the bet has started.
I also agree with Alan that once racing starts any non runners announced during afternoon should not reduce the overall number of places for placepot purposes. Shouldn’t be able to move the goalposts once the bet has started.
I think that’s one of the hardest things for new racegoers to understand, whether with tote bets or with bookies. When I strike my each-way or placepot bet I get paid on 4 places, it’s even printed on the bookies ticket. Then a NR changes the rules and I only get paid on 3 places. Almost seems like cheating.
I read the title of the thread as:
Advice of non-
triers
to the general public!
Now,
that
would be an interesting move by the BHA …
Dear anthonycutt,
On the rare occasion that I have a single win bet on a horse it is invariably in a race of 14 runners and upwards,and it is always an outsider of approx 16-1 or higher,and it always on the Tote.
I think you will find that 99% of the time the Tote win in these races where the winner is at decent odds will pay much better than the SP or any early price.I would suggest that anyone willing to take a price is unaware of the statistics. I first starting betting on Tote win pools when a horse called Star Appeal won the Arc at a Tote (PM) return of 96-1 several decades ago,and this has produced many a happy return over the years leading to (amongst many others) my win on Mon Mome in the 2009 Grand National at 156-1 rather than the 100-1 SP return.
I heartily recommend the Tote win to all those with an eye for a good outsider with a chance.
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