Horse racing in an independent Scotland

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  • #489785
    steeplechasing
    steeplechasing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5326

    Never talk politics, they say, although the school-time reminiscences have been enjoyable. Teachers, wherever they are – like punters – seem fashioned from the same off-cut of humanity.

    My own Scottish schooldays, 275 miles south of Wick,(on the days I wasn’t "dogging" it – dogging (dodging) had a sweetly innocent meaning back then) were peppered with similar characters to those mentioned so far.

    And…it’s a YES from me, by the way :)

    Never argue with a fool. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience, then onlookers might not be able to tell the difference. https://lazybet.com/

    #489802
    stevecaution
    stevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8298

    I had the YES canvassers at my door the other day. They were too late, as I have a Postal Vote and have already sent it in. You would think they might have factored that in when timing their door-to-door campaign but never mind.

    Anyway, I thought I’d get a wind up going and asked them about Horse Racing in an Independent Scotland. Needless to say they didn’t have a clue about the ramifications or why it mattered to me anyway.

    I told them I would vote Yes if The First Minister promised to change his name to Sheikh MoSalmond and divert the Scottish Oil wealth to build a Racecourse and Complex near Scone that would make Meydan look like a shed in comparison.

    I get the feeling they won’t rattle my letterbox again!

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

    #489896
    betlarge
    betlarge
    Participant
    • Total Posts 2655

    Proper plunge this evening with YES down to 3.4 and NO out to 1.4 ahead of a rumoured favourable opinion poll in The Times (allegedly).

    We’re back where we started!

    Mike

    #489927
    cormack15
    cormack15
    Keymaster
    • Total Posts 9977

    Aye SC, Mrs Oliver seemed a strange sort. No amusing anecdotes about her, apart from witnessing the late Ronald Robinson (Wright) climbing out of the window during her class after he told her he was ‘going home’and she’d stood barring the door.

    #489930
    stevecaution
    stevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8298

    Aye SC, Mrs Oliver seemed a strange sort. No amusing anecdotes about her, apart from witnessing the late Ronald Robinson (Wright) climbing out of the window during her class after he told her he was ‘going home’and she’d stood barring the door.

    Was Ronnie Robinson the guy who played in a band with Ray Trusty and Billy Munro etc?

    If so he was in my class for Physics with the late teacher Douglas Bilyard (or Willie Three Feet as he was commonly known) Mr Bilyard committed suicide a few years ago but I never really found out the details as I haven’t spoken to his nephews, who lived opposite us in the 70’s, for quite a few years now.

    Ronnie used to hang about with William Tulloch (Till) back in the early eighties and I hadn’t seen him since then.

    My brother in law is seven years older than me and he recalls the day in Mr Abernethy’s swimming class where "Bert" fell out with one of the 4th year hard boys who had forgotten his trunks. The upshot was the powerfully built lad picking Bert up and hanging him by his jersey from a coat peg, leaving him with his legs flailing in an attempt to escape. I’d have paid good money to have seen that one.

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

    #489959
    cormack15
    cormack15
    Keymaster
    • Total Posts 9977

    Aye, that was him SC. Sadly Ronnie died in similar circumstances to Bilyard.

    Anyway, I better stop before we bore everyone with Wick High School stories.

    #489964
    robnorth
    robnorth
    Participant
    • Total Posts 4125

    If you don’t mind I’ll just move in to break up the old boys reunion…

    Discussion regarding the Scottish Independence question at Perth today with both Sam Morshead and Peter Scudamore being interviewed on Racing UK.

    Sam is normally pretty bullish about opportunities but, having apparently had discussions with the Yes campaign about the financing racing post independence he was not happy about a reply along the lines of "it will be alright". He expressed serious concerns about Scottish racecourses ability to operate at the same level that they are currently.

    Peter Scudamore is concerned that the Russell training establishment would not be able to operate at the same level post-independence.

    Nick Alexander (local NTF rep) has made some thoughts public in his blog, and is a No voter, but avoided being drawn into the discussion on television.

    Interviewer Gordon Brown (the racing one!) was then taken to task by a "Yes supporter" about apparent bias in the broadcast, resulting in a mildly heated discussion which went on for a fair while and gained a bit of an audience. A handful of us had a chat with Broonie about the subject. I said I’m still pretty much in the Dinnae Ken camp wavering between Yes and No and, as an Englishman living in Scotland for 8 years, just a bit uncomfortable with the whole matter. A telling comment came from a guy from Northern England who said that people had to remember that this is "an all time commitment and not something you can change in a few years if you don’t like it". I know a few in the Yes camp who would get uppity about that sort of comment, but often wisdom can come from those looking on.

    I just wonder if the telling time might be those hours and minutes leading up to voting when it dawns on voters that this is for keeps. But for the noo I’m still Dinnae Ken!

    Rob

    #489965
    stevecaution
    stevecaution
    Blocked
    • Total Posts 8298

    If you don’t mind I’ll just move in to break up the old boys reunion…

    Discussion regarding the Scottish Independence question at Perth today with both Sam Morshead and Peter Scudamore being interviewed on Racing UK.

    Sam is normally pretty bullish about opportunities but, having apparently had discussions with the Yes campaign about the financing racing post independence he was not happy about a reply along the lines of "it will be alright". He expressed serious concerns about Scottish racecourses ability to operate at the same level that they are currently.

    Peter Scudamore is concerned that the Russell training establishment would not be able to operate at the same level post-independence.

    Nick Alexander (local NTF rep) has made some thoughts public in his blog, and is a No voter, but avoided being drawn into the discussion on television.

    Interviewer Gordon Brown (the racing one!) was then taken to task by a "Yes supporter" about apparent bias in the broadcast, resulting in a mildly heated discussion which went on for a fair while and gained a bit of an audience. A handful of us had a chat with Broonie about the subject. I said I’m still pretty much in the Dinnae Ken camp wavering between Yes and No and, as an Englishman living in Scotland for 8 years, just a bit uncomfortable with the whole matter. A telling comment came from a guy from Northern England who said that people had to remember that this is "an all time commitment and not something you can change in a few years if you don’t like it". I know a few in the Yes camp who would get uppity about that sort of comment, but often wisdom can come from those looking on.

    I just wonder if the telling time might be those hours and minutes leading up to voting when it dawns on voters that this is for keeps. But for the noo I’m still Dinnae Ken!

    Rob

    Sorry for cluttering up the thread.

    Thanks for the good crack. Time for me to move on. Be lucky.

    #489968
    steeplechasing
    steeplechasing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5326

    It seems to me that 3.15 on Betfair holds plenty appeal, given what the polls are saying and that there is no ‘form’ to go on here. At worst it’s level pegging. There’s no reason to suppose that the 18% who are undecided will mostly fall the way of the NOs.

    Am I missing something (from a passion-free, politics-free viewpoint, going on figures alone)?

    Never argue with a fool. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience, then onlookers might not be able to tell the difference. https://lazybet.com/

    #489971
    Drone
    Drone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5127

    Supposition because, as you say, there’s no form to go on and the behaviour of the electorate is unlikely to mirror that of a ‘typical’ election come voting day; but if we do choose to apply that dodgy form to this plebiscite then ‘undecideds’ do tend to vote for the status quo when they have the pencil and ballot paper in their hand. Late-stage indecision means they have not been influenced by a barrage of rhetoric from either side and are essentially ambivalent: hence continuation with what they already have and know is the most comfortable action… IMO

    I’d also take these latest polls showing a marked swing to YES with a pinch of salt: remember the huge poll-swing to the Liberals at the last election, with forecasts of 100+ seats (1.3 on Betfair at one point if memory serves) which didn’t transpire

    This is a huge decision the Scots electorate are being asked to make, with no going back and more importantly an equally huge degree of uncertainty over what independence will actually mean in the medium-to-long term for them and their country, other than the obvious ‘Scotland is an independent country’

    The British (in its current sense :) ) are conservative (small c) by nature and dislike uncertainty and the unknown so I expect a swing back to NO during the last few days of campaigning, and particularly on the day

    So if I were to bet ‘like a man’ at present I’d rather lump on ~1.4 NO (2/5, 71%) than ~3.25 YES (9/4, 31%)

    Is NO really only a 70% chance :?:

    #489972
    patriot1
    patriot1
    Participant
    • Total Posts 346

    There was an excellent letter to a local paper a few weeks ago stating that the No campaign would win due to the amount "aye beens" voting. These are the people who will vote no not because they want Scotland to stay in the UK but because "it’s aye been that way". In other words they don’t like change. These are the people who complain when the presenter on their favourite TV show changes or a new postie starts.

    The latest opinion polls are making things more exciting but I agree that come the day fear will override hope and ambition and the Nos will win the day.

    #489974
    patriot1
    patriot1
    Participant
    • Total Posts 346

    If you don’t mind I’ll just move in to break up the old boys reunion…

    Discussion regarding the Scottish Independence question at Perth today with both Sam Morshead and Peter Scudamore being interviewed on Racing UK.

    Sam is normally pretty bullish about opportunities but, having apparently had discussions with the Yes campaign about the financing racing post independence he was not happy about a reply along the lines of "it will be alright". He expressed serious concerns about Scottish racecourses ability to operate at the same level that they are currently.

    Peter Scudamore is concerned that the Russell training establishment would not be able to operate at the same level post-independence.

    Nick Alexander (local NTF rep) has made some thoughts public in his blog, and is a No voter, but avoided being drawn into the discussion on television.

    Interviewer Gordon Brown (the racing one!) was then taken to task by a "Yes supporter" about apparent bias in the broadcast, resulting in a mildly heated discussion which went on for a fair while and gained a bit of an audience. A handful of us had a chat with Broonie about the subject. I said I’m still pretty much in the Dinnae Ken camp wavering between Yes and No and, as an Englishman living in Scotland for 8 years, just a bit uncomfortable with the whole matter. A telling comment came from a guy from Northern England who said that people had to remember that this is "an all time commitment and not something you can change in a few years if you don’t like it". I know a few in the Yes camp who would get uppity about that sort of comment, but often wisdom can come from those looking on.

    I just wonder if the telling time might be those hours and minutes leading up to voting when it dawns on voters that this is for keeps. But for the noo I’m still Dinnae Ken!

    Rob

    One of the biggest problems with this debate is that too many people appear to be basing their decision on their selfish needs. Whichever way the e vote goes this will have ramifications for generations to come and that’s what people need to think about.

    And as much as I love my racing my vote will be decided by much more important considerations than the effect of independence on Scottish racing.

    #489976
    Drone
    Drone
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5127

    Indeed Patriot, but this is a Racing forum so perhaps just the place to discuss the more prosaic ramifications of Scottish Independence

    Perthshire, like Pembrokeshire in Wales has always struck me as a ‘Little England’ anyway and therefore a NO stronghold I expect; though expats do sometimes become vehement adopted-country nationalists. Mebyon Kernow in Cornwall seems to comprise, in the main, of retired advertising executives from the Home Counties :)

    #489977
    steeplechasing
    steeplechasing
    Participant
    • Total Posts 5326

    Drone,

    If that’s what the stats say about the undecideds, then I’ll hold off.

    Moving back to a subjective viewpoint, the NOs seem all over the place. Their clarion call throughout has been threat-based, and now it’s suddenly a cacophony of panicky promises. Their credibility – as strategists, at the very least, in the most important debate in the history of the modern UK – is badly damaged.

    I thought it a mistake from the outset for Osborne to be saying – you can’t use the pound. Who enjoys being threatened? Most cultures would react badly to such treatment and Scots can dig their heels in a fair bit deeper than others when faced with something like this, especially from a Tory bigwig.

    But possibly the most significant factor in recent days has been Salmond’s repeated emphasis that we are not voting for the SNP. The prospect of a traditionally Labour country being able to bring a Labour government to power for generations to come will be very appealing to many.

    And it’ll be a Labour government shorn of the sins and delusions of Blair (and hopefully, Brown). Ironically, Salmond’s implicit admission – ‘My job here is done’, might see the end of the SNP after a Yes vote, leaving the field to Labour for the foreseeable future.

    Never argue with a fool. He will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience, then onlookers might not be able to tell the difference. https://lazybet.com/

    #489980

    edinahib
    Member
    • Total Posts 198

    As a very proud scot the thought of independence excites me greatly especially as we have had govts we didn’t vote for for most of my life. The problem is the uncertainty of what will happen plus the total lack of concrete plans by the yes side and an intense dislike of soapy salmond. I agree with most people on here that the morningside nature of most middle class scots will prevail and the staus quo will be maintained. Pictures of a worried queen will scare the life out of the over 65s in Scotland. As for racing in an independent Scotland as in most things during the referendum the truth is nobody has a clue what will happen an we will have to suck it and see if it happens.

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